Grisell "Gigi" Peña
Gigi Peña currently resides at Amandla Crossing. She lost both of her parents within six months of each other due to COVID-19. Gigi talks about growing up in Cuba under Fidel Castro, major life changes, and her love for her family. She also discusses several of her and her family’s experiences after they migrated to the US.
ANNOTATIONS
Learn More: “About COVID-19,” Center for Disease Control and Prevention, accessed May 4, 2023.
Learn More [2]: “United States of America: WHO Coronavirus Disease (COVID-19) Dashboard With Vaccination Data,” World Health Organization, accessed May 4, 2023.
Learn More [2]: Genelle Levy, “The Real Story of Black Martha’s Vineyard,” Narratively, May 30, 2019.
Learn More [3]: Wilder Fleming, “The Pandemic Has Turned Martha’s Vineyard’s Housing Crunch into a Crisis,” wbur.org, October 22, 2021.
Learn More [2]: Jason Berry, “How the Catholic Church Survived in Communist Cuba,” The Atlantic, September 8, 2015.
Learn More [3]: Joseph Holbrook, “The Catholic Church in Cuba, 1959-62: The Clash of Ideologies,” International Journal of Cuban Studies 2, no. 3/4 (Autumn/Winter 2010).
Learn More [6]: Silvia Pedraza, “Church and State in Cuba’s Revolution” (Cuban Research Institute, Florida International University, 2009).
Learn More [2]: “American Experience: Cuban Exiles in America,” PBS, 2005.
Learn More [3]: Adrian Florido, “End Of ‘Wet-Foot, Dry-Foot’ Means Cubans Can Join Ranks Of ‘Undocumented,’” NPR.org, January 15, 2017.
Learn More: Belén Fernández, “The US in Cuba: A History of Organised Crime,” Al Jazeera, July 20, 2015.
Learn More [2]: Thomas Maier, “Inside the CIA’s Plot to Kill Fidel Castro—With Mafia Help,” POLITICO Magazine, February 24, 2018.
Learn More: Katharina Buchholz, “The State Of Military Conscription Around The World,” statista, January 9, 2023.
Learn More [2]: “Cuban Draftees Starting Service; Cut in Military Costs Expected,” The New York Times, March 31, 1964.
Transcript 1
Interview conducted by Dan Swern
Edison, New Jersey
September 16, 2022
Transcription by Hannah M’Lynn
Annotations by Carla Zurita
[Beginning of Recording One]
[00:00:00]
Uh, today is Friday, September 16th. It’s 3:05 pm. Uh, this is Dan Swern, here at Amandla Crossing, and I’m here interviewing?
Grisell, Pena. Peña. Um, and they call me “Gigi”.
Gigi, thank you so much for making the time–
You’re welcome.
To speak with me today.
You’re welcome.
So, whenever you’re ready.
Okay.
Please feel free to start from the beginning.
Alright. Well, um, I am Cuban born. I was born in Cuba in Havana. Um, on, uh, Father’s Day, on a Sunday, on June 17th, 1962.
[Editor’s Note: In October of 1962, American U2 spy planes discovered Soviet nuclear missiles on a base in Cuba. The discovery was perceived as an offensive threat, and President Kennedy established the Executive Committee of the National Security Council to determine a response. The committee was split between the following courses of action: invading Cuba, enforcing a blockade to prevent more nuclear deliveries from reaching the island, air striking Cuba's nuclear base, and pursuing no action. Ultimately, President Kennedy decided to enforce a blockade and placed all US forces on high alert. He announced the decision to the American public by making a televised statement. Nikita Khrushchev, the first secretary of the Soviet Union, responded to the blockade by turning their ships around and sending President Kennedy two letters. In the first letter, he promised to remove the missiles from Cuba if the blockade was lifted. In the second letter, he demanded the removal of American missiles in Turkey. The first letter was publicly accepted by the President. The second letter's demand was also accepted but the agreement was banned from being announced to the public.]
And, um, and that was, uh, well, obviously I, my birthday doesn’t fall on Father’s Day every year because the days change, but I see it as my dad, I mean, me being my dad’s gift? Um, because he always used to say that. [beeping] So, and I was, um, my dad passed, um, ru– you know, uh, I lost both my parents, uh, it’s gonna be about a year and a little bit over that, due to COVID. They passed within six months, both. Um, so that’s something that I’m not gonna stay with right now, because, uh, it was extremely difficult not to have been able, not to be there for them, because I was dealing with, um, my own health issues, and, [buzzing] actually, when my mom passed, I was on my way to rehabilitation from a surgery I just had.
[00:01:58]
[End of Recording One]
[Beginning of Recording Two]
[00:00:00]
So I was, um, I was trying to, um, talk about my– my mom and dad, which I can, I can talk about it, but I– it’s not easy thinking about it. Um, this June I turned 60, so normally age– first of all, age has never mattered to me. I’ve never seen that as an obstacle or a– anything to be ashamed of. So I was the– the one person that would be like, “Oh, I’m this old,” or whatever, and I never lied about my age. Well, that’s not true. I did when I was younger, to get in places. Um, not that at the time mattered much. Anyway, so I turn 60 this year and, um, it’s not, I guess what my, both losing both Mami and Dad, and realizing, first of all, they died sad and that to me makes me very upset, because, um, you know, my sister and I, at least I couldn’t do what, so much that I wanted to do for them, especially when I thought I was gonna be able to because of everything that I was going through. And I got sick. I was in a very horrible marriage. Um, but everything kind of happened the same time. Mom, my mom was going through cancer. Year, like five years before this happened, and she had stage four breast cancer. And she survived it, but when I say survived it, that means they basically burned all her organs by putting her through all the chemo and the other one they do. So, uh, she never really was her, was the same again. And my dad then had, um, heart surgery, and he had waited too long to do a simple procedure, and they warned him. When he came out of the hospital, my father was always active. And we always lived close to one another. And I’ll go back to that. Uh, since we left Cuba, somehow we always, it was the four of us. My mom, my dad, and my sister was a year and a half younger. We were always together somehow, close by. I mean blocks, or the next block close. So we were always, I mean, we were talking about, I slept my sister in the same bed for years because of the way it had to be. You know, that’s just the way we had to live. And again, I’ll explain that more later. So, I don’t want to get lost, because I– and I was, Dan has seen, I kind of go and get off the subject easy and I get very, like, I talk a lot.
[00:02:56]
So I have to focus a little bit, so you guys have to excuse me while you’re trying to learn my story. Um, also, I wanna say that I wanted to do this because, um, I think it’s important to speak about certain things that we as human beings go through and live and survive. Um, whatever! The happy and the bad, ha– you know, has to. We all live things and I believe we live it for a reason, and, uh, I always used to, I mean, I was told by everybody that I would, I was like Pollyanna. Pollyanna and Cuba didn’t exist when I got to this country. That’s, everyone was, “Oh, you’re such a Pollyanna.” I was like, “What the heck is that?” So I looked it up. So yeah, I did wear rose-colored glasses, pretty much until this situation happened.
[Editor’s Note: Pollyanna, a Disney film directed by David Swift in 1960, is based on a novel by Eleanor H. Porter. The film tells the story of a twelve year old orphan girl who lives with her aunt, a wealthy woman, that is preoccupied with keeping up appearances. Pollyanna's loving and infectiously lighthearted attitude challenges the status quo in the embittered town they live in.]
When I lost my home, my pets, which mattered more than my home to me. And my kids. Um, anyway! [sigh] I forgot what I was talking about and how I started this, but my 60th birthday, that’s how I started this. So, um, about a year ago I had a major back surgery. Um, I have a rod and I have bolts and they– they replace, um, bones. It’s– it was very complicated, but I was very blessed to find– it took me five years, um, to find this doctor, and I did. And he gave me my life back, because I was on a wheelchair and unable to stand up straight. I was folded over. Um, and excuse my English. I lose it sometimes. I try to brag about how good my grammar is, but I’m losing it. I need to start reading more. So, um, yeah, I was, uh, unable to walk more than four steps and the pain was unbearable. It was like, I– I’ve been in pain for years. Um, and I’ll explain to you guys, or whoever is gonna listen to this, um, what it is that caused the pain and how it’s gotten worse. But, anyway, uh, so anyway, uh, my 60th birthday. I– I always believed that you have to celebrate every birthday. I’m one of those. Because it’s not good if you don’t. So even if it’s a cupcake, you should blow a candle out, just to bring the next year. I guess it’s just something that we did. So! We did. And my kids, you know, I love sushi and I hadn’t had it for– you know, sushi’s expensive. Even though I know how to make it, but making it actually cost me more when I used to make it. And it was a pain in the butt to make it.
[00:06:04]
‘Cause it’s time consuming, but, um, you know, I learned how to make sushi. Um, actually my ex learned with me. He never had tried it and he loved it. Um, I’ve always loved sushi, so we had sushi and Thai. And it was great! So, after that, before and after I was thinking about, I always had it with these ideas. I guess you could call it a bucket list? And, um, there are places that I wanted to travel. And my biggest thing was, I used to want to go to Greece badly. Badly. To Santorini especially. And I had this fascination with the island. So, and then of course, I would joke about it, that I had to make it. And I don’t want to crude, so I’ll be, try to be. You can always take it out. Um, so I always would say, “But I wanna be topless, so I have to go before my boobs drop!” So! [laughs] Um, maybe I’d get away with it a little bit, but not like I would before, uh, but you know what? Who cares! If I do make it there before I pass, I will go topless, and the hell with everybody else. Who cares! So, you know, if I don’t make it to Greece, I do have plans to, there’s other places in the United States that are beautiful and that I love. I haven’t been to Maine, and I would love to go to Maine. I love to fish, and Cape Cod was a place that I love. Martha’s Vineyard, um. I didn’t go to the foofoo area. I couldn’t afford it. But I did, you don’t need that to enjoy the island. There’s beautiful places there, magical actually. So. I love the sea. I love any body of water. I love to swim. And I love the sun, and I miss it. So, I don’t know. My earliest memory is, of course, in Cuba. And, uh, I remember the place we lived at, the building. Yeah, my grandmother, my dad’s mom, was a seamstress, and she used to have a little shop, a little set up there. Not anything huge, but she would sew for different people. She was amazing. So, she was the one who made us pretty much whatever we were able to wear. Uh, at the time, during, when I was in Cuba, when I was growing up, those early years, Castro had already taken over.
[00:08:57]
So I believe that he had been power at least three years and a little bit more, and, um, he had taken down churches. Uh, not torn them down, but turned them. Uh, he took any, any religious, um, uh, [pause] any cross, anything that– that was part of the church. Any crucifix, any, you know, any, where the holy water sat. They put the holy water. And then replaced it with Che Guevara’s pictures and Jose, not José Martí. Not him. He’s the poet. Camilo Sesto, which is– he was part of the revolution as well. A lot of people don't hear about him. But he was a big deal in Cuba. He had his own day, too. And everybody threw flowers at the sea. I don’t remember, but I would imagine he died at sea, so we’ll go– and yes.
[Editor’s Note: In the 1970s, the Castro administration banned all American media as well as popular international artists from Cuba. In their place, the administration organized music festivals featuring Latin American and Spanish artists. Camilo Sesto, a Spanish artist, was among the select few included at these events. As a result, his popularity soared among Cubans. However, the artist's amicable relationship with the Castro administration came to a halt in 1975, when Sesto played Jesus Christ in the Spanish-language adaptation of the rock-opera, Jesus Christ Superstar. The administration, which denounced any organized religions on the island, swiftly retracted their support of the artist and removing him from their roster of media channels. Camilo Sesto died at 72 years old in 2019.]
In Cuba, when you went to school, you had to wear the uniform. And the uniform meant, they used to call it, call us pioneros. Pioneers. What tha meant was you were part of the revolution. And the way you proved it was you wore a red hankie around your neck. You know? Uh, and it had to be starched to death. It was like a, like a uniform. And I hated it! I hated it. I hated the fact that I had to wear that red thing, ‘cause I knew that it meant that I was approving with something that I did not approve with.
[Editor’s Note: The Pioneers of José Marti, or Pioneros, was one of multiple student organizations that conformed to Cuba's educational system. Membership of a student organization was required in order to attend the island's schools.The Pioneers included students from the ages of 5 through 14 years old and emphasized value formation through school-based activities. Student leaders in every classroom were selected to enforce the structures and activities assigned to them. Each organization wore different school uniforms to distinguish each other and participated in daily pledges of allegiance in support of Che Guevara and the Castro administration at large.]
Of course my parents would talk about it, but then I would see my mom and dad, that once they, once, the– the way you would get out legally was to go to the aid, uh, the embassy in Cuba. And you would put your name down, I guess, that you wanted to come to the United States. So they would literally, it would, it took years. I don’t know how they did it. It was some sort of a, like a lottery thing they did. And once your name came up. So my mom would have to go every day and check. Because once your name came up, you had a week to get out of there. Say goodbye to your family, bye bye! Everything, packed and get out. So there were planes flying with propellers, old planes that didn’t care if you die halfway here. But we did it. But anyway, so once you put your name on that list, everybody in the government, you were being watched. You were ridiculed by teachers, by kids. Not everyone. But everybody that was with the government would put you down and actually bully you, you know. It was crazy. Crazy! But I took that chance because I was, like, stubborn. And my sister would go put the thing on. I said, “No.” So, my sister being younger, first before going to the regular school went to some celebration day, I guess you would call it daycare or preschool? And, um, they fed them good there. We didn’t get the same foods, so she was [laughs] save food for me, like, fried piece of fried chicken or something. ‘Cause we didn’t get. You know, we had, we got a piece, we got a chicken, a whole chicken for the entire month. We got a– a liter of milk for the entire month. We got rice, a pound. Uh, we got a sack of potatoes. I remember, like, these things. Um. Don’t remember meat. But, no. I don’t think we got meat. I know we got chicken.
[00:12:50]
We got, um, don’t remember what other vegetables. Bananas, plantains, we did get those. And, uh, I think we got– Jesus, I don’t know, we got salt? I don’t know if we got many condiments, but I know that we got, like, certain things. ‘Cause I remember my mom being able to make pasta sometimes. And we ate a lot of rice.
[Editor’s Note: On March 12th, 1962, the Castro administration introduced Law No.1015 which provided one rationing booklet known as a 'libreta' to every household in Cuba. The food rationing system was under the purview of the Ministry of Internal Trade (MINCIN) and subsidized up to 88 percent of the cost of items listed in the booklet. Immediately after the announcement, hundreds of ration stores opened up across the island where Cubans would collect their designated food portions. Portions were calculated based on the number of reported household members. The items included in the list fluctuated from time to time depending on the scarcity of the item. Broad bans on exports and the import of sugar from Cuba contributed to a lack of access to certain foods and to an ensuing severe economic crisis. Generally, fruits and vegetables would sometimes be removed from the libreta altogether and be sold freely due to their increase in production on the island, while items like eggs were often in and out of the libreta's list. In response to this system, a black market for the sale of food developed. The administration often responded to households that circumvented the system with harsh punishments including severe rationing, prison, and military service.]
My dad and I used to [inaudible]. So. Let me, let me go back younger. So, I love bread. I have this thing with bread. So my, [laughs] my father used to love to have a beer or two. And my mother, because her dad was– her stepdad, even though she adored him, he had an alcohol problem, and he was always loving to her. But obviously what happened between her mother and him was a different story. You know, I don't know the details, but I know that my mom being the oldest out of her two siblings wa– had to take over as the parent at some point and left her studies. She had to take care of the two because her mother fell into, they didn’t tell her at the time, she’d say she would have headaches, but it was depression. So she would fall into this weeks of laying in bed, and my mother had to be the kid that had to take care of the other ones. So, that will answer your “why” my mom became somebody that I didn’t recognize at the end. So, um, my mother was a stunning woman, and everywhere she went, she got attention. And happy. Always smiling. Always loved to dance. An excellent dancer. Um. [tsk] But, and, and she was with, you know, she was part of the Communists. She– she would have stayed in Cuba if it wasn’t for my dad.
[00:15:03]
But anyway, so my dad had, being born in Cuba, he was born in the country, which is the, almost the, near Guantanamo Bay. Which, stunning. I was very lucky to be sent there on vacations because my mom had to take care of my sisters who had kidney problems, and she was, like, extremely thin and not healthy, so she was in the hospital as a babe, as a little kid. So I was alone. My mom wasn’t with me. I was with my dad, my dad had worked. So then they would decide, you know, on the– the, when school was off, I would go on “vacation”, they would call it. Which was to the countryside, which to me was a dream. I mean, picking fruit from the trees and the– the river. It was magical. It wasn’t rich, you know. Like, it wasn’t a mansion. I remember they had a tin roof, and I loved to hear the “ding, ding, ding” on there. Ah, those were some of the best memories I have, because my dad’s family was very simple and loving. And it’s funny, they had no lights, no electricity, so it was totally dark, pitch black when it hit, and I remember them carrying the lanterns, and you looked up at the sky and it was a blanket of stars. Like, you don’t see it now. Yeah, it depends on what part of the world you are. So I remember, like, just being, just in love. I think I learned how to escape, um, whatever hurt me and the ugly things that did happen through imagination and Disney was a big deal to me. I had no idea about this whole Nazi thing that they said. I don’t wanna talk about that. But I used to be in love with him. Like, and then when I found out that he was frozen, I would always tell people that when I get to the United States, I’ll be old enough that they’ll probably be able to defrost him and I can marry him. So it was him, it was Billy the Kid. Listen to this. But it was a character that played Billy the Kid. I think he was a French actor? [laugh] Fell in love with him. And the, um, oh my God. Hold on, one more. There was another French actor. Alan de Leon, who was stunningly gorgeous. But he, they used to play all these foreign films and the only American films that they allowed were either musicals, which is fine by me. Gene Kelly, who was another crush of mine and one of my heroes.
[Editor’s Note: Eugene Curran Kelly was as American actor and dancer born in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. He began his career in Broadway and planned to return after satisfying a requirement in his contract to work on a film. Instead, after his film debut in 1942, he continued his career in film acting and went on to redefine the musical film genre. His athletic style and classical ballet technique earned him the nickname, "the king of musicals." Among his many celebrated works, Kelly is also known for his role in the iconic dance film, Singin' in the Rain. Gene Kelly died in 1996 in Los Angeles, California.]
[00:18:01]
Um, you know, that I looked up to, his dance. I danced. Uh, dance was a passion of mine. Um, but the movies they allowed were black and white Samurai movies. The best ones, which to this day, they consider by one of the best directors. So I was like, I was watching this, like, art! So my dad and I would go to see the Samurai movies. Whenever we had food, my dad would make rice balls, like, you know, like the movies. And my sister and I thought it was a meal. And it was! And then we also used to call, “We’re gonna, we’re gonna go to the white sheet theater.” And the white sheet theater meant he would put a sheet up and then do, you know, put the, the light and then do puppets with his hands, and we would do that as entertainment, which I thought was very cool. And eat rice balls. [chuckles] Now, I don’t understand how, to this day, how it is that you were able to have certain times that you were allowed to go see movies and they gave you this little bag with candy. That was the only time that we had, like, candy like that? And, but again, I tell you, I would sit there for hours. Another thing I did was, with my mom, I would go see the musicals. But, they were, like, for 12 and up? And now I’m getting ahead of myself before, because now I was 8, I think? Just before we left almost. You can get rid of that. Um. So I was, yeah, I think about 8. Just to turn 8, but I was always very tall and looked older, and they kind of overlooked it. You had to be 12 and up, because people were in underwear or something. Nothing race, like, you know, nothing outrageous, but it was like, not good for a kid to see, they said. No sex scenes, nothing, just kiss in there. But they were musicals, and they were like, like classics, like Singin’ in the Rain and all these things that I grew up with, and, okay. Now, my godmother and godpare– father. They used to go to the opera and the ballet. Um, one of the most famous ballet dancers in the world came from Cuba. One of them. Alicia Alonso. And I was very lucky that I got to see her. My godmother would take me to the ballets and we had, like, front row seats. And I would sit through the entire thing when I was, I don’t remember. But I was like, like 5 when I started or something. Maybe even 4. But I loved it. I was like, “Oh my God.” And the operas.
[Editor’s Note: Alicia Ernestina de la Caridad Martinez del Hoyo, known as Alicia Alonso, is a Cuban-born dancer regarded as one of the greatest ballerinas of the 20th century. Alonso moved to New York City in 1937 where she continued her professional training at the School of American Ballet. At the age of 19, she was diagnosed with a detached retina and forced to use stage lights to guide her performances. Despite her deteriorating eyesight, her formidable talent garnered her international acclaim. Looking to expand accessibility to a dance education, Alonso founded the Alicia Alonso Ballet Company in Cuba. After refusing to join a cultural council supporting Fulgencio Batista's dictatorship, the company collasped due to a lack of funding. The company would later find financial support in the Castro administration.Today, Alicia Alonso is celebrated for her inimitable roles in Giselle, Swan Lake, and Theme and Variations. She died in in 2019 in Havana, Cuba.]
[00:21:12]
And I would be like, totally like, into it. So I wanted to be a ballerina. And I was like, I wanted to be. I would practice, I would get on my toes and like, to the point that, [laughs] hurt myself. I would do anything! Jump. Well, that dream went down the drain because in Cuba, as in Russia and China and places like that, they kind of just do that if the, you’re gonna become professional? Like they did at the time? And they can take you to the Olympics? And, or, you know, you become a star? And they, I have flat feet. And they already knew I was gonna be taller than, you know, ballerinas. I didn’t know this. Ballerinas need to be small! It makes sense. So they can be picked up easier, you know? I mean, so I had no idea. Even though I was lanky and I, and I guess skinny as hell, and I, you know, and all that. It didn’t friggin’ matter. So that broke my heart, but I kept on dancing. I said, “I don’t care!” So, um, anyway. My memories of Cuba were me staying over my– my godparents’ house and I remember their bed, like it was here right now. And the bed had a window above it, and you could smell the orange trees come in the breeze. And I would wake up to that. And they, that was in Havana though. But it was beautiful. They had a really pretty back, you know, backyard. And then they had traveled around the world? So they had a library. And the library was full of Reader’s Digest. And I had Reader’s Digest, it was one of my favorite magazines because of, my, well, it is a great magazine. In my memories of it, you know? So he would sit with me and go through different parts of the world and show me pictures, you know, that Reader’s Digest had, and read stories from there. He, um, he was, he would, we would take walks. He, like, he would teach me different foods. Um, and my godmother had fashion that she had put away. Hats from like, 1920s and art deco clot– I mean, Jesus Christ. Whoever got their hands on that jewelry. ‘Cause we couldn’t get out with it.
[00:24:04]
They tried to take everything away from you when you get out. The only reason my, I do– my mom hid a couple of rings and earrings. And they didn’t search where she put it, thank God. And in our earrings were, uh, diamond, but, you know, we’re talking like the good, beautiful, old, you know? Our mother– there was always a screw with the– they had these things that they don’t, they still have them today, but it’s made so that they, you know, twist it so it doesn’t fall easy. Well, Mami jammed those things in her ears so they wouldn’t be able to get them out. And man, they were pulling on her ears [laughs] in the airport! That I swear they were gonna tear her ears off, but they couldn’t. So we able, we got out. The memory of that day, oh. Before, before that week. That week. Well, first let me tell you about my– my– my dad was put, um, as punishment. ‘Cause he was no longer allowed to do what he was doing. So they sent him to this camp and, um, what they call the camp, but he was, he was stuck with a– cleaning this entire– lot of people would have to cut, uh, sugar cane. Ah, you know, it was like a, a punishment, you know. So Papi had to be part of building the Lenin part. And he would come home with thorns that my mom had to disinfect after taking out this big. I don’t know what kind of friggin’ plant he was taking. I’m not kidding, it was crazy. So, I mean, all over his feet, his arms. It was crazy. So Mami had to, you know, spend like two hours when he got home digging those things out and then he would have to go back again. And do it again. And my mother was not as harassed as my father was, except that men would constantly come up to her and say, “If you do this for me, I’ll give you this.” You know, sex. And it was horrible! It was constant. Constant. She didn’t do it, except the Carnival. There was, then they had a Carnival, which was great until it became really dangerous. It started to get dangerous. Um, because they gave food out and it was, you know, people wanted the food! It was, you know, good food. It was not like, all you, you know. Normally got your hands on. So they would give you one serving, but you had to be there. You couldn’t take it for your family. You had to make the lines. That’s another thing. Um, anywhere that you went, that you were allowed. If you had the money, and I would love to find out how they got the money right now, how they paid them, because that’s a part that I don’t remember. You know? Because they did get paid for something. But it was very, very little. So whatever it is that they had the money for? Uh, or any restaurants that were open, right? Because there were some that were open, and I remember going to them. You had to make a line. The lines were huge. And there was one that served pizza. It was like an Italian. Um, and I’ll never forget the few times that we would get to the, right there, a one person before us, and the food was, there was no more food. [phone begins to ring] So, there was a, af– after waiting hours–
[00:27:46]
[End of Recording Two]
[Beginning of Recording Three]
[00:00:00]
Isn’t that insane? She came, ‘cause she’s, um, well, she had, uh, Spanish, uh, and French in her. She had the, like, blue, uh, crystal, like the ocean. Those really light, odd blue eyes. And that’s me with her. My baptism. Love my godmother. I want to see her. But anyway, no. I’ll show you those. I have pictures to show you so you can get an idea of it all. So anyway, my dad used to take me, for the bread I was talking about. The, what I remember. The good things I remember that, I was very close with my dad and it makes sense because my mom was constantly having to go to the hospital with my sister, and she would stay there. And, um, and my dad and I had the same kind of stupid, goofy kind of personality and sense of humor. And he didn’t judge me or take– Mami was more of a, um. I– I was very, kind of a dreamer, and I would always believe that if you work on something, you can make things happen. I never thought it was easy, but I never, I didn’t want to hear, “No, why would you do that? That’s not practical.” I couldn’t stand that. You know? And that was what I had to hear from my, my mom. And, like, I think it stopped me from wanting to do a lot of things. But anyway, the week before, when we found out, um, I remember my mother coming home and she was in tears. I remember she had been crying, because she had to leave her entire family behind. Entire family. Brothers, cousins, aunt, mother. Everybody. Uh, sister, you know? And Papi was the opposite. Oh yeah, I didn’t say this part. My dad’s uncles, you know, and family actually, most of them except the ones in the country, they stayed there. Um, their son, ‘cause they only had one son, and they had him older, their son became an architect later on in life, but he came. He did come, one of the uncles. He went to Venezuela. So here’s what happened. In the 1950s, these guys went to Venezuela, half of them. And the other half went to the Dominican Republic. And they started building, so they became millionaires. My father worked in Venezuela in the Amazons, and God, do I wish I had those pictures. Uh, he had pictures of him with Indian, like, from the Amazon, like, the women with the no top, you know? With the guard? It was crazy. It was the coolest thing I’ve ever seen in my life.
[00:03:04]
So he had that, you know, experience. But then after, I don’t know. I think it was, he told me it was over five years, no, six years. He went back to Havana. And the first thing, ‘cause my mother happened to live in the same place, same building as my grandmother. So my dad, he does, this is the way he tells it and the way she tells it. He gets out of a cab with a suit, you know? This is, my father was tall. He looked good, you know? He was, uh, he had a presence about him, and especially when he was younger. Um, so he shows up, he gets out of a cab, and he says, “And I see your mother, dressed all white, with the old tan. And I saw her, and she smiled at me, and I said, ‘I’m gonna get this little bonbon!’” [laughs] That’s how he put it! “I’m gonna marry her!” And they did. Unfortunately, it wasn’t the fairytale that my father had lived. He had lived, he had been with other women. My mom was 18. My dad was 24. They were both kids, don’t get me wrong. My dad had been doing this shit for a while. My mother was a virgin, and even though she danced at the CopaCabana and was, you know. Dressed, not, you know, provocative but sexy, but she was, you know. A good girl. Like, a good girl. So, the first night began, that was the first disaster. [laughs] Oh! But anyway. And they had a baby right away. She didn’t have time to grow up. I can’t even imagine that. You know what I mean? That’s crazy. So. [sighs] Unfortunately, my dad wasn’t there at the birth. Um, she never forgave him for it. They did have another kid. And then, of course, um, it’s not like they had much of a chance when it comes to honeymoon or anything. ‘Cause, you know, they had the whole thing with the crap going on in Cuba, the instability. My father tried, you know, they were trying to get out with the paperwork and all that. It was rough and I– I can just imagine, how do they keep a marriage normal like that? But I do remember that the– the tension. In our– the tension.
[00:06:01]
Um. I rem– I had nightmares from as far back as I remember. Uh, I– I was a little kid, every night. I did not have one night without a nightmare. And I also saw spirits. Actually, one in particular. Um, every night I would see this guy. [redacted] You know. And he, he wasn’t a scary looking guy. He was like a, maybe 38, late 30s, 40s. From what I remember. Thin, kind of tall? And all he would do when I would see him was, he– I would always see him in the kitchen and kind of, almost like he was cooking or preparing something. That’s all the guy did. [laughs] That’s it. Scared the shit out of me. I mean, I was a kid! And he didn’t move, but he did look at me. And I thought it was my imagination, but damn. I don’t know! Maybe it was. And that wasn’t the only thing. I’ve been known to see that before after 2. Um, and when I was younger, I would see in these things and I would also, like, think about something and, or, with someone and they would all of a sudden be coming, or I would see them across the street or, you know. They say that some people’s, when you’re little you have– you either have the ability to– to see things or to, our brains. Nobody knows. It’s a mystery. And then as we get older, we start blocking things. I believe that. But anyway, my, the whole thing is that, um, being at that apartment that we were at was odd. I had very weird experiences there. And then, when the day, I’m leaving things out, but I’ll remember it because I’m leaving the places that I went to that were good. You know? That, like the times at the beach. Also, there’s pictures of my sister and I topless, just with the bottoms, and I never realized how weird that was until somebody pointed it out to me. Because we were like five, six? That’s kind of weird. Girls. [laughs] Think about– it is kind of weird! So, I’ll show you the pictures. Kind of weird! I mean, we were kids! But it is kind of weird, like, I didn’t think of that. And then I remember, like, getting a whole bathing suit? But I don’t think it was weird to kind of do what we were doing. I– I only found it odd when somebody said, “Why didn’t you have a whole bathing suit on?” But I never thought of that! And we also had to wear orthopedic boots because we had, you know, I had scoliosis and they were like black combat boots.
[00:09:12]
And nothing else. That’s the only ones we got. And if your foot outgrew it, ‘cause it only, it was only once a year, my foot outgrew it a couple of times and my mom had to cut the front of it. So my toes would come out. [laughs] Until we got to Spain! [laughs] We didn’t have time to get new ones, and so I got out. Except that we had these beautiful red corduroy dresses that my grandmother made for us. They were, I remember them, like, exactly what they looked like. And, like, the color red was beautiful. It was like that raspberry red. So we went and we get to, when we get to Spain, it was actually had started to snow. We were not prepared for that. We had no coats, nothing. But I have to tell you more about that, because we got lucky when we got there. Um, so. I guess, I’m trying to figure out, ‘cause I’m lost. There’s so much to talk about. But I don’t know. What and which area to get into. Like, it’s rough. Um, there was a lot of things that happened that I didn’t tell my mom and dad because I didn’t want to bother them. Like, um, there was a guy who worked at the– the Italian place who would sometimes do a favor for my dad and my mom and give them– oh, I know what. I was telling you about the carnivals. So the carnivals, they would give you a bottle of rum. That was part of it. The bottle of rum was a big deal, because my mother was able to exchange it for two meals at least. Therefore, she could feed my mom and my dad and my sister. I had, I was the one who would go with my mom to get, uh. There was a, the black market that if you got caught, you went to jail. So that was the chance you took. But they called it that because there were people that somehow got their hands on– on produce. And my sister needed, like, chicken soup to get better or something like that? My mother would try and I would go with her to be able to carry the stuff. So I was like her little, you know, I guess, little psychic. So, um, I remember the carnival lines, and I remember, of course, I’m trying to focus on the carnival and Mami’s trying to focus on not losing the line. Also, my mom, for Christmas? We had to, they had had a store that would give you three or two, do– two big toys. They called in a little one.
[00:12:04]
Um. If you got there early enough, or if you, before they ran out. So my mother, a woman, would spend a week, if not two, with the neighbor that would switch to try. Oh, man. It was brutal. You wouldn’t, I’m telling, there was, there was fights. Thank God Mami never got– but my mother was, my mother was five two only, but, I don’t know. I never saw her in a fight. But my mother stood up for herself and us. So, um, yeah! She would spend nights to get us the toy. At least, something. And boy, we did! You know? And if it wasn’t for that, we wouldn’t get it. Because not every parent did that, or was able to. See, the thing was, they would run out of it. If they run out of it, no matter how long or days you spent on that damn line didn’t matter. So that was terrifying to my mother. So my mom was actually, that’s why she had to spend so many days. Because she would wait early on and some people didn’t have that. You know? I mean, that’s crazy when I think about it. We’re talking about two weeks sometimes! You imagine that shit? It’s like camping out for the iPhone! But anyway, it’s okay. [laughs] They do that, or, you know, whatever. But, um, that was an issue and she made it happen. But most people did not celebrate. You didn’t celebrate Christmas any. If you were with the government, you didn’t celebrate Christmas. But we did. Christmas was out. So was the Catholic Church, so was the Jewish anything. Didn’t matter. Everything, you had to bow to Fidel. That’s what I meant. They put a big, [laugh] they change all the crucifix and everything with his picture. I was like, we talk about ego, okay? And nobody saw this shit coming. [whispers] I have to stop cursing. Nobody saw this coming. Baptista was also corrupt. But at least it was open. So there was more opportunity to move around. Now, he was bad, too. Don’t get me wrong. He was like the Mafia. So he was, you had to pay him to have a busi– he was a piece of crap, too. But at least people were able to, they were freer. Not free completely, ‘cause you couldn’t just speak about him negative either. ‘Cause you’ll be beaten to death or killed. So it wasn’t like he was some God, easy guy. It was already brewing. Nothing good was gonna come out of that. So, but, you know. I don’t know. I think that, um, I’m kind of stuck right now.
[Editor’s Note: Fulgencio Batista, also known as El Hombre, "the Man," was born on January 16, 1901 in Banes, Cuba. He began his leadership as a celebrated Cuban soldier and went on to hold power over the Cuban presidency twice. His first presidency was considered to be a progressive and efficient administration that ran from 1933 to 1944. His second return to power was as a dictator and ran from 1952 until 1959. During this time, he developed relationships with American and international mobsters and made fortunes from lucrative black market businesses. His unwillingness to step down from power, and his continued investment in making Cuba a haven for criminals, led to increased public opposition as well as increased support for Castro's revolution and guerrilla attacks. In response, Batista suspended constitutional guarantees, relied on increased policing and fear mongering through open displays of brutality to quiet the revolution's supporters. In 1958, these decisions proved to be fruitless as Fulgencio Batista was forced to leave Cuba effectively handing over power to the Castro administration. He lived the rest of his life in in Spain and Portugal and died on August 6, 1973 in Marbella, Spain.]
[00:15:01]
I don’t know why. I’m always talkin’! It’s weird. I think I don’t wanna get to the ugly parts. [snorts] Oo! Yeah. Well, in school, when the kids found out that we were, they call gusanos. Um, what, what do you call that word? Um. So, they would pick on us. My sister was definitely stronger than I was as far as, not mentally. I’m not, mm. Not stronger. She would slap somebody, have no problem with it or, or just punch somebody. I was the peace maker and I got bullied, even though I was older and taller. But my sister would not care. You know? She would literally punch a kid, no problem. So she protected my ass. So, anyway, um, it’s too bad that we don’t have a relationship, which I’ll get into later. But, um. No matter how poor people might say we were, I remember happiness and I remember love. You know? And yes, there was pain, and there were things that happened to me that I didn’t tell anyone. You know? Like, people that did inappropriate stuff to me as a child. But I didn’t let it, um, well, at least I didn’t think it would affect me until obviously I became older and I had my own relationships. You don’t realize that, you know? But I was not somebody that, that, like, I would, things would happen and I would figure out a way to somehow turn it around in my head, or I would sing. I would get a brush or a comb and start dancing and singin’ and look at myself in the mirror. And boy, I liked myself. I used to remember, like, dancing constantly, constantly, and always thinking that I was gonna be, I don’t know. Something in the stage. Um, I love attention. I used to always love to be making people happy and laugh. And I didn’t like when people were mean. And I didn’t understand it, especially when there was, there were just mean and there was no reason. Like, they would just turn around and bother you. Say “hello” and you didn’t say “hi” back, or you were smiling, and they would just kind of give you a face.
[00:18:09]
Um. That’s something that I don’t understand why I couldn’t handle. And it took me, I still have a hard time with it. But it took, it took me a long time to realize, “Look, everybody’s different, and you never know what someone’s going through that day. But that’s just people that are just jerks, and you’re never gonna change that.” You know? So, um, when we were leaving, um, my mother had to make sure she got those outfits made and she thought of corduroy because we had picked Spain. Not Mexico. They gave you a choice, Mexico or Spain. And, uh, I’m glad my parents chose Spain. And we even thought about staying there, but– but my dad’s family was in the United States already, in Brooklyn. My uncle, who’s my aunt’s, not, he’s not my blood, but my aunt’s husband at the time was doing his residency at Brooklyn. So what happened was is that my grandmother was the one who was sent to, at that time, Venezuela to meet us in Venezuela after Spain, and for the paper, it was a long, like, crazy ride, you know? To get the documents the right way. How long have we been doing this today?
[00:19:39]
[End of Recording Three]
[Beginning of Recording Four]
[00:00:00]
Um, so we get, when– when my grandmother made us these outfits and, well, we could only pack the basics. I don't even remember what they did. I remember that, that my mom had that, um, that luggage forever. The one from Cuba. The one, it was, jeez. I think it was one bag for everybody. But anyway, when we got to the airport, the one thing I do remember is that, oh! I left this out. My mom’s entire family stopped talking to her. Didn’t come to see her leave. No one. Except her brother, her younger brother that she was extremely close to, and so were we. That, I didn't want to leave him behind. He, since he was a kid, wanted to leave Cuba. But because he was a man, and he was, you’re, during the military age, whatever, they don’t allow you. Not even try. So he was screwed. He was the one that, um, I ever heard the Beatles from because he and a friend had got his hands on records. And he had a record player at his, uh, house. My, my grandfather’s house. So I was like, “Oh my God!” So he used to love, like, everything American. Which is crazy, because he did end up getting here. Um, very rare, like, like this. He didn’t look like himself. Didn’t. It’s, he had really, really, and he was, I mean he was like fifteen year– no. Ten years younger than my mother. But he looked terrible. And he got here through Mexico, through this old border thing they did. I guess how Mexicans go and they take this, the dangerous way, and they pay people? Well, he got it! He went that way. He was able to do that. And, uh, survived it. But, um, only to get here and find out that he had throat cancer. So. But he did say to me several times, “I will not rest in peace if I die in this place.” Meaning Cuba. Because he was so against Communism. So he didn’t die there! He died soon after.
[00:02:42]
[End of Recording Four]
[Beginning of Recording Five]
[00:00:00]
We, um, unfortunately, even though I did get to see him, thank God, and, I mean, Jesus. It’s har– it’s sad because, I mean, don’t get me wrong. I still think that he did what he wanted to do. He got to Mexico and he, I remember speaking to him, and they put him up. That’s, whatever this, the underground railroad was, [laugh] that they got the Cubans? It was, they were separate from the Mexican. The way they did it, I don’t know what they call it. But it was some major, like, one of those, like a movie! Something I’ve never heard of in my life! So, they had it. All these people had it all planned. They probably still, oh, I don’t know if they’re still going. But you had to pay. And if you had the cash, it was, they, they transfer you. Can you imagine how crazy that was? So, anyway, but they put him on a, like, a four, five star hotel when he got there. In, ah, Acapulco. Purposely, because they knew they had been, uh, you know. This is all, this, this whole organization, human organization. So they put him there, [inaudible] “I’m eating lobster and steak and shrimp.” And I said, “Oh”. That made me feel good. So he had a blast! He went to the pool. So he got to feel that, you see? Then, that was only for about two days. And then it was off to the races. Then he got here, and yeah, we were a little shocked when we saw him. It was, it took you, it was crazy. He looked, uh, he couldn’t weigh more than sixty pounds, maybe seventy. I don’t know. He was small man, but still, I mean. And he just looked horrible. So, he had aged so much. And then, of course, um, when he went to the doctors and got throat cancer, I knew it was bad to have throat cancer, but I didn’t realize. I ain’t never had to think about bad it was, ‘cause that’s burning and everything. You can’t eat. So it’s not good. He ended up, his son got here before him. That’s my cousin, who I’ll show you a picture of. That’s another story. But he got here, um. He actually got here in one of those boats that they take a chance when they get here. So. I don’t know how those people do it, but you’ve gotta be pretty desperate to do something. He made it. So anyway, he got here, and, uh, he had already settled and only not, not, I mean, about a year before that. He had settled in Florida. So, uh, was working and so was his wife at the time. He had a little boy.
[00:03:07]
And they were both working. She was going to school to, uh, to learn how to teach in English as well. And he was, um, doing whatever he could for money. He was waitering and, um, a warehouse and all that. So, um, first, my uncle came to visit us, and he spent two weeks with us. And, um, my– I couldn’t go because I was, uh, dealing with my back. I couldn’t go for a walk. But it wasn’t as bad yet. Uh, but I was feeling, I was, I hadn’t had the surgery yet. I was struggling with the knee. So, anyway, that was be– anything before I lost. This whole nightmare happened when I fell. So, um, anyway. They went. They took him to see the Statue of Liberty. They took him around Manhattan. Um, so, they took him to, I think, even Chinatown. So he got to see parts and he, Jesus. Then he went to Florida. And that’s when he got really bad. He started to tear– I mean, it was going. It was stage four already when they found it. So, um, he didn’t, he didn’t stop smoking. And, uh, he died pretty fast. He died, um, a year, not even a year that he was here, he died. But he died where he wanted to die. So, to me, that’s better than not, you know? And it’s, I think it’s, that was another hit on my mother. ‘Cause she was hoping to have her brother. And she didn’t, so, um, unfortunately. But, um, and then Mami gets cancer. That was crazy. [silence] Uh, I just need to, uh, make sure that my life has a better end than theirs, for my kids’ sake. I don’t want them to think I died, you know, unhappy and– [sigh] Being a parent is rough. So. Anyway. Another thing that, that did hit me when I turned 60 is that I, for the first time, I really wanted to go back to Cuba, because I had not been back. And I feel like I never belonged anywhere. [silence]
[00:06:46]
[deepy, shaky breath] [voice breaking] Anyway– You know? My parents got to this country and they never knew about social services. They never knew about food stamps. They never even, I didn’t either. But all they thought about was where they were gonna work and how they were gonna get money to get a car, and clothes for us, and food. And they did whatever it took to do that. Without any aid. That’s how I was raised. [sniff] When I first had to, when I started seeing that I had nowhere, no money, nothing. No vehicle, no, I didn’t know what to do. It was, ah, really, really scary. It was weird. I can remember, we started to go, I had started to go to the food bank after I went to an interview. First I went to the food bank. You know, this was, um, just before Thanksgiving, ‘cause I had no way of getting anything. To make a meal, you know, to make a Thanksgiving meal. And I remember thinking, because I was all dressed up for the interview. And everybody there, there was a lot of elderly people. It was a line. I happened to have gone the day they were giving baskets on Thanksgiving. And, uh, I had no idea how it worked. But I remember, all these people kind of opened up for me. They all stood up, stepped aside, thinking that I was somebody better than them.
[00:09:00]
Because I was dressed. And I was there for the same reason. [voice breaks] I felt so bad. And all of a sudden, I feel like, I never put people down for that, for being down, when I was, when I was working. And I always, I did the March of Dimes. And always gave. I donated money as, to as many things that I could, and as I had access to less money the last couple years of my life before everything that happened, um, happened, I remember, when I used to go to the supermarket, then they’d always have those things out for food banks. Two dollars, five, whatever. One dollar, two, three, I forgot what it was. [sniff] And I would ask the cashier if they add it. And I used to give to that because I figure it’s better than nothing, because it’s something. And I ended up needing it. So it’s important that people give back, no matter how little. And even if it’s not monetary, that you give yourself in some way. ‘Cause you never know where life is gonna take you. But, um, I know that God, my parents, they hate that I lost the house that I worked so hard to get to begin with. That was devastating to them. And I don’t want them to think I– that I– I was gonna, that we were gonna be– They couldn’t help me. My sister was the one paid their mortgage even though they would pay the food and all that, but. [sniff] It was an agreement, and my sister was making out better but, it is what it is. I didn’t take the choice. They filled the house up and they offered me to move in with them, but because I knew my ex was already, boy, he was drinking already too much and doing other things. And I couldn’t put my parents through that. So I didn’t tell’m that, but I said, “No, I don’t think that’s a good idea. I don’t think we’ll have the privacy.” And I know my mother took it as an insult, but it wasn’t an insult. I was trying to protect’m. [sniff] And my father would not put up with him treating him the way he was treating me. So he was gonna be mad.
[00:12:09]
So I tried to keep that away, and me by doing that, and also, I had three kids. My sister had one who my mother babysat always. I never had that, you know. I would work around how, what do I do, who’s gonna take care of them? And I went back to work with both the first ones, right away, you know? [sigh] [sniff] But with Christopher, I had no one to take care of him. So my ex convinced me that in order– instead of paying daycare, which is– it is expensive, he made a lot of money, he did as a union foreman. And he, we could do until he went to kindergarten. And I agreed. So, once I did that, I gave all my power away. I didn’t think it was gonna go down like that. But it did. [sniff] So, here I’m thinking that I’m doing the right thing for him, and it was the biggest mistake I ever made. So. [sigh] Oof. I isolated myself more and more as things got worse through the years. [sniff] I had no friends. No [inaudible]. Um. My family thought I was, I would come around too little. We lived literally a block away, but my dad used to walk over to my house every day and bring me bread from the bakery when it was op– when he was able to, until he got sick. So every morning, it was annoying to a point, ‘cause I couldn’t even sleep. But he would, I had a little window in my door, one of those little things, and you could see him going like this. [laughs] Sometimes I would hide from him because it was 5:30 in the morning. I’m like, “What the hell is he doing here at 5:30 in the morning!” He’s like, like this looking through. You could see his eye, ‘cause it had like this, some, it was like yellow. I had, uh, taint, uh, tinted, so you couldn’t see really well but boy, he tried. And sometimes he was so obnoxious that he would knock on the side windows. But it was ‘cause he needed to talk to somebody, too, and I was his outlet.
[00:15:20]
He was, do you understand? So. I miss him. [sharp inhale] I miss him dearly. And I hate the way he died. [sniff] What kills me is that I couldn’t be here. As the COVID thing was going on, and I was in the hospital both times with his and hers. But my sister didn’t even wait to do anything for me. So it wasn’t [inaudible] or anything. Anyway, um. [silence] I don’t know if I can do. I think I need to organize my thoughts to do this better. I think I need to put, I’m gonna do from, like, a certain age to age. Four years, you know, I’m gonna try to organize it, ‘cause, you don’t understand. I have, like, I feel like I’ve lived three different lives. I really have. Because of the different stages, it’s like, so extreme? And even the people who I've been with and dated and where it’s taking me, all that is so crazy. I mean, people you would know. Famous people. It’s not a big deal, but it allowed me to be places and see things that maybe some other people didn’t. [sniff] Bottom line is, we’re all the same, no matter who the hell we are. You know? Some have more money than others. That’s the difference. Power. But, um, everybody, rich people are dirtbags, too.
[00:18:02]
And they can be low. They can be stupid. They can be, you know, trash. Even if they’re rich. Money doesn’t give you class. And, um, I’m glad I saw that firsthand. And also, money can make people great, and others, terrible. You know? ‘Cause they just don’t know what the heck to do with it. I mean, I don’t get that. Don’t get me wrong, I don’t get that. ‘Cause I know exactly what I can do with that. But I don’t gotta understand that. But I guess that’s something, I guess, you would have to have some struggle to be able to understand. I think that everybody in this world, in order to be a better human being, needs to walk in somebody else’s shoes. Or, at least make themselves educated, or educate themselves in some way, so they are not so close minded. Because that’s why we’re in such a mess right now. I mean, could it be uglier? It’s bizarre. So. I mean, I feel sorry for the younger kids, honestly. Yeah, I am too! I’m like, I’m like, oh my God. I can’t imagine. It’s hard for me to see, but at least, thank God, I didn’t have to. My young years when you have to deal with that, stuff that’s going on. I don’t even know what to call anyone! Like, my daughter is the one that’s always correcting me. And we argue. I mean, we’ve had fights, fights about this. Because, I’m like, “Okay, the part that you do not understand is that I am me. And I know I need to learn and be respectful, but at the same time, that side, this entire side, this new world, where is there compassion or patience with everybody else that grew up in a different way? With different ideas? With different words? What, are we supposed to all of a sudden wake up and know every single damn thing you’re supposed to say? Everybody’s new name? Uh, every word that you’re not–” No! You need to learn it! You know? It doesn’t happen overnight! And people are not necessarily, are trying to hurt some people. Some are, I’m not saying they’re not. But I don’t like to insult people. And I have! Sometimes, lately. And I’m like, “What? Why?” But, you know, I didn’t realize it. And not a big insult, but just, you know, like, I just got, I have to watch. But oh, I have to tell you about her and her boyfriend. Who's now transgender. Oh, God.
[00:21:16]
Which is fine! Trust me. But, she’s been with him– let me see. [sigh] Sophomore year, went into junior year of high school. They were together until she was 23. Wait, 24. [pause] Almost 25. It was a long time. And this whole thing started happening a year and a half into their relationship and she didn’t tell me. So she was miserable. But there was nowhere to go for her. And she didn’t tell me. Can you imagine that? That’s crazy. But a lot of it makes sense now, when I remember him never compliment her or kind of little things, oh, that’s another story. That’s, I talked to him, ‘cause, listen, not her fault. And that, I gotta get, I got into an argument about that. And I was like, “Okay. So I’ve been calling you Colin for years. You think that I’m not gonna slip and forget that? Call you something else now, completely different?” So I’m like, “No. I make mistakes.” “You did that on purpose.” I’m like, “No! Why would I do that on purpose?” So, yeah. That’s another thing that’s come with the 60 year old, too. My voice [sniff] still hasn’t come back from the surgery. You asked me about, uh, I had a fall. And it was 2016. A fourth fall. I slipped on some sugar and I tore my achilles heel completely. I still have a complete tear in my ACL, plus other tendons. This, so, it locks. When it locks, it’s bad. When it gives, it’s bad, too, ‘cause I might fall. So, thank God now my surgery, I feel stronger than ever. You know, I couldn’t stand, I couldn’t stand up. You know, you’ve met me already, kind of, you know, but you should have seen me before. Melissa can tell you.
[00:24:01]
So, um, I don’t know, Dan. What I’m gonna do is that, ‘cause right now I feel– [door buzzer] Shut up. I feel– [buzzer continues] Like, I’m glad we finally did this, because now I have an idea of how to put my, you know? Like, more organized, so I’m not losing myself like I am right now. Like, I’m thinking about my father, and I don’t want to get stuck on one thing, so I need to make sure [buzzer stops] it’s jotted down, which I did, but I didn’t do it the right way. I need to do it by age. Age, not year. Age. This way I– I can see myself during that age. It’s easier than the year. When I see the year, I start putting all the events that happened that year, you know? And all that. That’s not good. I gotta talk, we, I saw the moon landing. [inaudible] I’ll never forget that. Pretty much after that, we got out. [sniff] I want to show you pictures, too, so you can get an idea of, like, the family dynamic. Well, the family. What they look like, and were, sort of where I came from, you know? But I’m mentally kind of drained right now. Ah, many, um, and you can do as many as you want with me. I don’t care. But I need to be more organized, ‘cause I feel like I’m, I don’t want to rep– talk about stupid stuff. Even though everything matters. I want to talk and make sense. [silence] [sniff] I feel like I’m not really telling you much right now. [pause] I’m upset. [pause] I always try not to get upset. [pause] It’s hard. [sigh] The only friends that I have are guys. And that’s not real friends. From school and stuff. I’m not dating. I haven’t dated, nor do I want to, in over six years. I don’t have any need for it. But friends, I like. You know what I mean? Like, friends are fine, but try having a guy friend.
[00:27:00]
It’s not working for me. And that girl, one of her friends I made in North Bridge, they could have all slept with my husband, so, I guess they weren’t my friends. Yeah, but then, luck with women. I don’t know why. But it’s been a problem. And I don’t– I don’t, I’m not a jealous person. Like, I don’t. I hope whenever I had a girlfriend, we would go out and we would–I would. But that was up north, my friends that I grew up with that were in the same kind of circle. But I try to do it here, it didn’t work out. Um, I don’t get it, you know? It was weird. I, uh, I don’t, I would never do that to anybody. That’s crazy. Like, you know what I mean? Like, let me, hug me and talk to me, love me, but what you’re doing is screwing my husband. Like, what do you get out of that? Three of them did it. It’s humiliating, and it’s sad. And the people that I open myself to, you know, it’s like, try to get one up on me? I don’t get it [whispering, inaudible] They all knew it. So, there was a lot of ugliness there. Uh, that’s what I mean about Cuba. I don’t know how, and if I will ever go back, [sniff] but I hope to God that I can make some of those, you know, plans that I had come true. You know? It’s– you can’t– we have to make plans for the future, but you have to live every day a little bit of what you want in your dreams. ‘Cause you never know, you don’t know what tomorrow’s gonna bring, so yeah. And love with all you got, and give. I think that if, I always thought if you were good to people, they would be good to you back, but I guess that doesn’t always work out the same way. But I guess you can’t let those people, you know. You can’t carry them with you. Now, of course, those are things that never leave you. It’s kind of impossible.
[00:30:02]
I’ve gotten better, but I mean, I can’t even. The pain? And the anger is gone. Sometimes I get angry, but the anger I had of, like, how could someone do that? Just leave us, just like that, okay? [sigh] I’m just, it is what it is, you know? It was done, so now, I would like to try to do this, especially after the surgery. Because before the surgery, I couldn’t, I couldn’t do a lot. But I’m beginning to do more, so, when, as soon as I start that, especially when swimming again. That’s gonna help me a lot. My biggest challenge is my mobility, not being able to do things for myself. That drove me crazy. It’s still hard. I’m still struggling with that, you know? And what am I gonna do? How am I gonna buy a car if I can’t pay for the insurance right now, unless I have another income? Oh! And I wanted to talk to you about the art thing. I was talking about last time about it, because I have a bunch of ideas, and I would love to work with you on that. That’s another thing that I want to talk to you about. Because she’s too busy. She’s, I mean, so are you, but I mean, it’s like, we’re never gonna get anything done! [laughs] There’s a room there, there’s, I mean. God, something’s gotta happen, you know? It’s a shame that it’s not being done. So, especially for the kids. Then they all get stuck, they can’t do anything, can’t go out and play. It’s not right. And a lot of these parents are, I mean. [pause] I, they– they. Ugh. Again, I don’t understand the mentality. It’s not something I, when I was that age, you wouldn’t have caught me dead, stuck in a situation like this. Trying to get out, do something. If you’re able to move, walk. You understand? I understand depression, I get all that. But being stuck and, if you still have your youth and you have so many years ahead of you? What are you doing? It isn’t– and I don’t– it’s a cycle like that. It’s really, really hard to see that. And the kids suffer because they’re limited. I don’t, I just, I try to talk to them. Um, it didn’t go well, you know? So I had to learn to just keep myself to myself. I’m sure that, you know, uh, what’s her name? She’s had issues also, that, you know, she thinks different. She has a different mentality when it comes to home rules or maybe, I don’t know. I’m babbling, ‘cause I don’t wanna say anything. [laughs] I’m trying not to say certain things. You know? But I can’t. I’m done. I don’t have it in me anymore right now.
[00:33:55]
[END OF RECORDING FIVE]
Transcript 2
Interview conducted by Dan Swern
Edison, New Jersey
October 28, 2022
Transcription by Hannah M’Lynn
Annotations by Carla Zurita
[Beginning of Recording One]
[00:00:00]
Yeah, and I know that.
So, this is Dan Swern. Uh, it's 3:09 PM. I'm here at Amandla Crossing, and I'm here sitting with?
It's supposed to be “Gisell.” Turn out to be, the birth certificate, they put an “R” in it and it was left that way. So it's been a constant battle. When I got to the US, ‘specially because no one heard of my name. But! I decided that if I shortened it, like a lot of people do, and said “Gigi”, which is, um, a lot of people got that, even after they hear before. I don't know how, but they never did. And, um, that's what I use as a nickname. And that's what I start– or “G,” you know? I am, I just turned 60 this June. Um, the only age that has literally kind of bothered me? ‘Cause age never meant anything to me? This one did, and I'll explain later about how I feel about it. Um. I also, I said before that I had a home at one point that I worked very hard to get. Um, the property, even though it was supposed to be a starter, and it turned out to be longer than that, which is fine by me. I made it cute. It was cottagey, by the water, the view. You couldn’t ask for anything more beautiful, and it was peaceful. They were able to leave your doors open, your car open. The best thing was, the school was what I was hoping for, and it was the best one I could find in the area. That I could be close to my family, which by the way, turns, this wasn’t by accident. We, I looked. We've been, and my parents, my dad and I, my sister and myself, who were the ones that got out of Cuba. We did. And that was the family. That was us. And we somehow always try to figure out a way to be together. Even as my sister and I got older. You know, our parents did everything for us, so they feel like they, we, they– they– they needed to hold on to us. To hold– to keep us safe to an extreme. But I, that's all they knew. They were afraid. And, being women, even though we were already growing up at a different place, that they have no clue at the time that it was so much more advanced than they even expected. And the stuff that, when I started school, I got here first. I got here, um, where it was supposed to be three months. Three. The longest, six. But it turned out to be a long, to little over two years that I didn't see my family.
[00:03:10]
That became more difficult by the week, sometimes by the day. I did stay with my family, my dad's family, immediate family, his younger sister. I– I apologize, older sister, Martha, who was well-traveled. It– when she was in Cuba, because she happened to be friends, best friends, with one of Castro’s sisters, younger sisters. They both attended the same school in Switzerland. Um, this was like a– not everybody in Cuba got this luxury. This was knowing the right people and coming from the background that you came from, usually money. Education. And that got you a lot further than someone who wasn't educated because of the way that things were going down and the corruption and everything else that was happening. Sadly, no matter what part of the country you were from. The people from the– the– the, you know, Havana, which was the main place where everything was happening. The Copacabana, all the Mafia guys comin’ from Miami and Brooklyn and God knows where else. It was a playground for the, you know, many, many, um, United– people from the United States that just basically took a boat and came here and did, they had, it was like a dream to them. They, there was no laws. They got away with anything and there were beautiful women to play with. Um, Batista was a corrupt, um, dictator? Leader. He was dirty. He was in with the mob and anything that gave him money and power, which was the downfall in the end. The sad thing is that Cuba was extremely advanced, something that a lot of people don't realize. That, um, I might be incorrect about this, but I believe when I was very young, that I was told that Cuba was the place where they– they built the first color TV. I could be wrong about that. I need to look that, seriously, I need to look into that. But I do know that they had everything that the U.S. had and other European countries. So it was a combination of, of what we had, plus a little bit more of culture, different cultures because they had, you know, they brought things, being an island. Not only were they, um, we were surrounded with different people, Chinese Jews, that I– I was like “Chinese- Jew? Does that exist?” Of course that's stupid! Judaism exists in every place, pretty much. Pretty much, I guess. And, and, um, anyway, I was raised Catholic until Castro. When Castro took power. I was a kid. I must have been 5 going into 6.
[00:06:31]
But I was extremely observant and nosy, and I would hear everything. And I just kind of knew when– parents were– things were happening. Um, unfortunately, my parents bickered almost daily and my mom was 18 when she had me. And I said this before, she had been with no one else. She was a good girl, she loved to dance and have fun with her friends. But she was a good girl, and innocent. She was oblivious to sex. Not really, nothing. My mother never spoke about it. It was one of those things. My dad, on the other hand– he was born in Cuba, in the country. But his uncles, being the, whatever, they're being, just, all they thought about was money and power and they made the choice to leave Cuba in the 52nd. Can’t tell you when, but it was enough time that they did it easy. They took the money, they took, I don't know what money they took. All I can say is that there were thieves. Even though they– they were like white collar thieves, they were still thieves, and they were not very nice people when it came to getting what they wanted, so. Ah, three of them went to, ah, Venezuela, Caracas and started building properties, and, in different areas they were very smart. Even the Amazon, which was untouched by many at the time. So, the wonderful thing is that I got to see pictures of my father, who was asked to go there and work with them at 15 years old by his mother. And he had no say in it. So he is a kid sent to the jungle and he learned a lot. Um, learned a lot from very, not very great people to learn from, but he grew up fast. And he worked hard, and the best was me seeing those pictures that I wish I had in black and white with the indigenous people and the women with their breasts down, which is normal. Was nothing odd, and the man with the, it was crazy to see this Indians that are living, you know, living in their world. And I'm sure they still are. I'm sure there's, I– I don't know. I haven't researched it, but I'm sure that there is still there somewhere some of them.
[00:09:07]
There were, according to my father, they were kind, beyond kind, friendly. They spoke a dialect, but they tried to learn, you know, how to speak to them and, um, like I said, my father, my father was shocked by all this. So, you know, they had everything there that they needed. They built some stuff, then they went to the capital. They built some stuff there. Then they did the same thing with the Dominican Republic. The other half of the uncles, they made-up big, big, big. They gave people business and they did treat– it was bizarre. You know, it's like a dictator or somebody that's mean, oh, like somebody that's seen us at the– the– the, um, the evil person, but yet the town loves him? Because it's his town and he will do anything for anyone in the town and anyone that would come to them, they would give money or help or fix. And if they got sick, they were, you, you know any people like that are like that, they're, there's– They're like one or the other is an extreme.
[00:10:22]
[END OF RECORDING ONE]
[BEGINNING OF RECORDING TWO]
[00:00:00]
Alright, um, when– I'm gonna skip because I've talked about how we lost the home and I ended up in some hospital because I was in the streets, blah blah blah. Okay, I was in the system, and I suggest that anyone, start– any trouble you see in your home. Anything that you feel you're gonna lose. Anything, any intuition, don't be afraid to start going places and start asking, “What if? What if I need this? What if this happens? Who can I call?” Get yourself on a database, something, so that you're ahead of the game in some way. Because if anything like this, God forbid, ever happens to you and you're not prepared, and trust me, you're not gonna prepare anyway. There's no way to prepare for this. But at least have something. Like, I had a support group that I put myself in when I knew that I was gonna need it, and that helped me get through. I know it did. And it was still horrible. But I got, I'm here, I'm here. So let me go to where, after I was in the, in the, um, psych ward, um, that I asked for extra days in the hopes that I could get the, um, I had a case worker that I had gotten through 911. She boo–I believe she worked through Catholic Charities or Coming Home. One of them. Or Volunteers of America. They're all good. Now, um, one: this woman would tell me what number I was up to as far as the list to get into because I wanted to I– I– I had to do some research on the– the shelters and I mean, I had a– a young man and– and I'm a woman of, that comes from, um, um, abuse, domestic abuse and, uh, John Mill Station, all this other stuff that did not need to be, at this point in my life, surrounded by men that I knew were probably there for doing what was done to me. So, this place was only for women when I looked it up. But when I got there they had just changed to family. Because when I first saw two men with their kids, I was kind of, “What is this?” I mean, I thought this was all women. So I felt unsafe and uncomfortable. And I already feel that uncomfortable the moment I went to get breakfast, because I was kind of hara– not harassed.
[00:03:04]
Um, I, I don't even know if it's a proposition or it was cut away. “If you're sweet to me, I'll give you what you want for breakfast. If you're sweet to me, you'll get what you want.” This coming from a male worker at the shelter who knows better than that. Who is, wasn’t a young man. Who has been advised not to do that. But he did it to every woman he found attractive. And if you didn't play the game, and I don't mean give him anything, but smile when you wanted to, kind of, tell him to go fuck himself, maybe. Excuse my language. Where, you know. Don't you have daughters or have some self respect? Or, “Don't ever speak to me like that again.” If I would have done that I would have suffered the repercussions, which meant that I was getting in the shit and the stick, or, there were no dishes for me or food, even though I would ask. If I had an appointment with the doctor, they would save you, or if I couldn't get out of my room because remember, I just. I was in a wheelchair and I could still not move right. And I was in severe pain. So they put me on a bunk bed. The second one. And by the grace of God. That lady who had the bottom bunk bed had just left that morning and I happened to get her bed. It was a little smelly. So I had to disinfect the mattress a bit. But hey, it was a bed. They gave me sheets. I mean, they did put your clothes, and they said it would take a day, maybe two, to de–to kind of, you know, clean it and put it in this box. It made this noise all night. Then I find out entire time that I was there, that damn box wasn't working. And I wonder what was making that noise. So, now people come with lice and other things in their clothes. That's the whole point of this because it’s supposed to filter any kind of anything, any bugs, anything like that. So, I made it a point to check. Nobody had cleaned that for years and I made, I pointed it out to the people in charge. Ignored. Um, there was cameras everywhere in this building. Everywhere. Okay? Except the little bathrooms. You know, the bathroom. There was two bathrooms on the first floor. One on the second. Same amount of people, maybe more on the second. Had one handicap. And of course everybody wanted the handicap. It was the biggest. You could take your kid, you know what I mean? And, literally use that. It was easier. I get it. But then, when I had to go and you had to be out of that building by nine or you missed breakfast. So, now, see, picture this. You wake up. Right? I couldn't, I could barely move. Course, if it wasn't there yet. I could barely put my shoes on. You had no one to help you get dressed, and if you think any of those ladies are gonna help me, pft. One of them tried it for a little while, until she got sick of it. Actually, I was helping her, because she, I thought she was worse than I was, and we got to the place, I would serve her like a maid. And then I found out the woman could move better than me. Anyway, it doesn't matter.
[00:07:01]
When he wasn't there, I was with three or four other women. The rooms, I told you, are like, if you go to a dorm room. The size of a dorm room. Not an expensive one, a cheap one. And the one thing that gives, that's extra room, is the, the, it's one, [clears throat] one chest. And everyone gets a drawer. One drawer. Anything you cannot fit, they give you these kind of, um, trash, [inaudible] Oh, chests that you put your clothes in and whatever. I had to put it in plastic because it was dirty. But hey. And they do give you a key for lock box in case you have any– I never got one, but I could have got one if I wanted to. I didn't think anyone was steal stuff from me. I found out too late that they did. Um, you couldn't leave anything around when you went to the other building because you don't know who's gonna go in there. No one was supposed to, but that's all. There were people working there that were not ethical, did not do things right. Did not care for the workers. And there were others that did. But those that did, God. Literally. Stepped on. They ended up eventually having nothing to say. Nobody listened. Nobody invited them to the after parties with them. Yeah, I was out. So, two people like that. Kind. They were great. They were on the way out the door. So either you join the camp, or you were out. And that should not happen.
[00:09:02]
There was a woman that would go there on the weekends, and if you hear the way she spoke to everyone on this, on the intercom. It was horrific. She made fun of people, she put people down, she threatened people. It was insane. And she, you could beg her for food and to how sick you were. And she’d say, “You got a doctor’s note?” “No, I couldn’t get to the doctor. And I don’t want to go to the ER again. Because I can't breathe. I have to do my nebulizer, stay in my room.” I had all my eating, all my little things, but I didn't, you couldn't drink the water. It wasn't safe, you know, the water from the tap. So imagine everybody trying to get bottled water. For the kids and everything. You know how difficult that is to maintain? It should, there should have been enough, but there wasn't enough. I don't know why. The same with, um, they had a full kitchen. And you could cook healthier foods, but yet they chose to, the easier way, which is frozen. Frozen, like. You know, raviolis, frozen, mostly pasta. I had a problem with that. And so did other people. And some people have families that would bring them food, or the Indian community was great about that. They supported one another. You know, I wish to God, because I love Indian food, I wish they would have, like, hooked me up with it. But the girl was, there was one in the girl she was, oh my God. She was harassed so bad. You have no idea. Because she was looked at as weird. The girl was scared. She spoke no English. I finally made friends with her. Then trusted me. She– it took three months with that girl, maybe four, to even let me get near her. Because she was so traumatized. She must have been 18. With a little baby, and she was taking care of her baby, making her food. So then people got pissed because she was going into the kitchen to make the kid food. Because the kid was gonna eat. Um, ramen noodles for breakfast. Or some cereal that she would make homemade. Food and stuff. You know, whatever. What's wrong with that? I mean, unless your kid wants to eat it. So, I'm there. And I was told I had to be there Friday. So, of course I'm gonna follow up whatever they tell me, but then I get there and nothing is done on the weekend. Nothing. My case manager said, “Oh, you're, you're, you’re Gigi?” “Yes.” “Oh, well, um, I'm leaving. I'll see you Monday.” “Okay, where am I going? What am I doing? I've never been to one of those places before. Somebody help me? What do I do? Where's my room? What are the rules? Who the hell's gonna tell me what to do here?” It was hours. Hours. Nothing. I asked several people. Nothing. “I don't know what to tell you. Nobody's here.” They weren’t there. “Oh, the caseworkers are gone for the weekend. They come back Monday.” “What you’d want me out of Friday? In the afternoon. When no one is gonna be able to help me. And I'm in limbo.” Couldn't do anything except feel weird and out of place. Because no one talked to me.
[00:12:53]
My hair was blonde and they thought I was white and I'm like, “What the fuck? Are you kidding me? I don’t look white. I look like something, I don’t look– whatever.” I don't know if I should say that. [laughs] No, really. That doesn't sound right. Listen, I get along with everybody, but I couldn't believe that. I’m like, what? So they weren't talking to me. Pretty much just observing me until I spoke Spanish. “Oh. You speak Spanish?” “Yeah, I was born in Cuba.” Kind of changed a little bit, but still. I– I was like, “No, I thought you were white.” White is not a color, but it's okay. Whatever you say. There was one girl that had six kids with her, and they were not quiet kids. They were loud, disrespectful. Little monsters. God forgive me, it wasn’t their fault. And she went out every night. Got out every night. The kids were all over the damn place. Two buildings. The night building were allowed there after 7:30. Wouldn't get there ‘til like 8:00. They kind of encouraged to be in bed by no later than 10:00. Now, you have no time to decompress. You're not allowed to have TV, radio in your room, or a fan, or anything electrical. I don't understand. It felt like– like– like a, I told you before, it felt like a somewhat low-security or a blue collar prison where we didn't commit any crimes. But yet people were treated with very little respect.
[00:14:59]
Can I get many reasons why? Because you gotta play both sides. I saw people take advantage of people there. The people who worked there. I saw people steal. I saw people lie and play the victim and get away with things I couldn't even get for a year and still didn't get. Because they know how to play the system, and they would brag about it in the TV. Like it was like nothing. It was like, wow. So, I was liked because I was older. That helped me. Because I was older. If I had been younger like them, it would have been an issue. But because I became more of a mother figure, and because I was honest about the way I spoke to them. I didn’t hold back, I said, “You're tell– you're asking what's wrong, and you wonder what's going on with this, what you doing wrong, what's happening. But you know already. You said it.” So it would make them see. Sometimes it stuck. But in the end– and all the kids loved me. Oh my God. To the point that they got weird. It got weird. They would fight to get the door. It was like, [laughed] Like I brainwashed them. So everybody would run. You can ask Melissa. They would run, “Gigi’s here, Gigi’s here!” The parents started to hate–[laughs] Not hate me, but, wondering, like, “Is this lady putting something in my kid’s drink?” It got that weird. Like, they, like, trample each other to open the door for me to help me. It was wonderful. It was wonderful. But then all a sudden, no one would never know where, what, but one particular girl that lives here still, [redacted], who was like my baby. I mean, these kids were like babies when I met them, in strollers, they didn’t walk yet–
Gigi, I’m sorry, you’re, this is someone who you met at the shelter–
The shelter.
Who lives here now?
[Redacted]
[END OF RECORDING TWO]
[BEGINNING OF RECORDING THREE]
[00:00:00]
So there's a few people here that live here that I know. [Redacted] So anyway, she's something that I have, the closest I have to family, I have to say, you know? Thank God for their cush– I know that she's got the same other, you know, the same kind of thinking as far as the way she wants to raise her kids. Right and wrong. Not perfect, just the right idea, or my– my way of thinking. You know? Not all the way. Because they're a little bit too extreme with, um, certain things. Or they're trying to make her, one of her friend join the church. And, like, women only have to wear skirts. And that's fine. It reminds me of, um, a Jewish, um, what do you call that? You know what I mean, right? And I always say, “Hey, I don't care if people are used to living a certain way. That's fine if they're happy.” And I always say, Jewish men make the best husbands. Because, maybe I'm wrong, but please help I’m not. [chuckles] I mean, this is what I’ve seen, not what I really know. Oh, oh, that look. I don't know. That's what I've heard. I don't know. So, I worked, you know, in the, in the fashion industry. Textile. That's loaded with Jewish families. So, I never had a problem. They was like me. I always got along with them. I think it was the way that I just expressed myself. Um, okay, so. The shelter was an experience that I– I don't wish on anybody. It took a lot of my belief in human nature and kindness. I was very disappointed by the way some of these people fell off the face of the Earth, and I knew they were never going to get back just because they were ignored.
[00:03:08]
They had mental health issues, and I had spoken to them a few times, and a lot of them were very bright. One particular woman that was very elegant, you can see that she had something at one point, or seemed like it. Just everything about her, you know? The way she walked away, she wore, even if it was old. But it was just something about her. And she was very, very well-spoken. And she sat it with me and told me stories about travel. That was real, which I believe that it happened. Oh, she had been all over the place and she was well off. Oh, boy. I never got out of her what happened, but I believe it was a nervous breakdown, and it really was sad. I don't know what she ended up. One day I saw her, the next day I didn’t. There was another one, [redacted], who had some difficulties keeping up with, uh, you know, her, her bank. You know, little things, number stuff, but nothing that could happen helped. So she was convinced to handover all her financials for them to help her and that, I told him not to do that. And now she's regretting it. But the scariest thing was that you didn't know what was next. And the fact that those buildings were so separate. And in any kind of weather, you had to take it. There was fire alarms that they made us go through and sometimes they would do it to play? And I knew ‘cause they were laughing and they would even tell me sometimes, because a lot of them would talk to me. Until they stopped.
Gigi, I'm sorry, you mentioned someone handed over her financials.
Yeah.
Can you– I, I didn't quite understand.
There’s a– there’s a– there’s a service that they provide to guide you, to help you. You had to sign.
Who's they? That helped?
I don’t know who did it. Um, I'm not sure what company did that, but I know it's online. I'll look it up. Okay, and try to find it. Let me write it down or write. You want to send it to me? Send it to me. Because I know that I kept it because they tried to get it to– to– me to do it, when I was at one of the rehabilitations and I went like, oh, “You gotta be kidding me, this one was even worse”. This was putting me in as a permanent resident of town. Of the, um, the friggin’ rehab thing as a patient, for the, that's it. Like moving there.
[00:06:07]
Oh, that’s, it's stuck there. Yeah, my kids were probably full at it, but I was signing this with a notary and everything, and I didn't know what it was. Because they had me all drugged up until I said, you know, “Let me read this before I sign it.” Thank God. So anyway, that happened to her and she did move out of shelter, but she's, the last two times I spoke to her, ‘cause it's been a while now. It's been like a year, but I mean, a year is not that long. So she told me, they're holding my money. They don't want to give money to buy this to buy. And she was never a spender. So that bothers me, if you know what I mean. Because I'm thinking, are they doing the right thing with the money? Who knows? She has no family. None. That scares me. And the same thing goes for the fact that I have to sign yet another contract, without me holding money. Today. Not a contract, but a, a payment agreement to something that was taken care of by this state. Because, Melissa helped me apply for one, and applied for two when I was accepted because of a low, low, low income. It was below the poverty thing. And, [chuckle] They all helped me, and I have the numbers for them to refer to. The money was dispensed, took a while, but. Where's my money? That was for me! That was money that I applied for! I went and I called. I had to give up my information so they could look it up. You know, to make sure that I qualified. They do this background stuff. And I got all the details, but it’s like, “Why?” They even said to me, “Don't sign. They're not supposed to be sending you threatening, or eviction notices. I’ve gotten three with dates. Okay?” And I've been paid more even though it was paid already, so that, to keep it peaceful? They haven't added what I've paid. I've told them, like, the last four times I've been there. She's written them three times. You know? “Ideas, numbers, you signed it.” He said, “No, I never did that. We never did it.” I said, “We did it three times.” I have two that I can take to you. The other one, I’ll find. But I mean, I don’t know what to do. They don’t want to give us receipts.
[00:09:05]
But yeah. I have my receipts. I’ll show you my receipt. And you tell me that you didn’t receive the payment. So it's– it's your word against mine, because he didn't give me a receipt. How am I gonna defend– how is that gonna look to a judge? Not bad on my side!
So, uh, so who is, who it–
What do I do?
So, you’re talking about doing payment agreements with the Mission First Housing Group, or some–
Yeah.
Okay.
They’re the ones that are pushing the body to send and do the letters, and– I don’t know what’s going on there, Dan. But I'll tell you what, if you’re making buildings, if you’re building, right? You're getting money funded, you’re getting funded to help people with issues, whether they're drunk or mental health, anything, right? You gotta be doing it for the right reasons. You’re doing it for money, you know, being anyone? And they just opened up another one, and I think it's great. But if shit doesn't get straightened out? Or, they're doing it now. They're, they're, uh, Aline McConnell [sic], (editor’s note: she’s referencing Eileen O’Donnell of Coming Home Middlesex County). Unless I know that they're working, this the first time that I've been here, that is finally, this is really happening, like it's legit. Because before you, they will say, “But nothing ever got done. I don't know who is running who, so I cannot blame anyone when it doesn’t get done.” Anyone, remember everybody, somebody has above, somebody above, and these things are not simple, you know? ‘Cause you get people who lie all the time, and they’re so used to that that they cannot see the new wave of people that are just like everyone else. That didn't break laws, that are not living life, that lost things because of their jobs. There's a big wave coming, and the kids are coming, too. How are they gonna address it? They have to fix this. And that's what I have been constantly fighting and speaking. And you know what? I’ve seen Eileen take notes. I said several things that I see them in a newsletter, and that gives me relief that at least somebody, mainly, is really listening. Sometimes you don't know until you're on the other side, and you can't blame them, because if you haven't lived it, you have, you don't know. How would you know? I had no idea. I had no idea that they would let thirty cantaloupes rot instead of peeling them. And, um, that guys could, you know, basically tell you, “If you don't flirt with me, or you don't laugh with me, or you're not cute with me, you're not getting this.” [overlapping] Til then, so–
How did you end up transferring from the shelter to Amandla?
[00:12:06]
So, when you're at the shelter, your duty is when you get up, whatever, you know, you– you go, you get out of the building by 9:00. You try to get to the breakfast, you eat whatever it is that they have. Um, you are supposed to have ten, at least ten apartments that you called, looked at, inquired about, emailed, whatever. It's like, um, unemployment, so that they, which makes sense, so that they see you trying to find places. Thing is that when you call as a person from a shelter without a caseworker, any of– most of these [inaudible] hang up on you or don't wanna talk to you, so, it's almost like wasting your time. And they have three computers. Which are, that's all. There was always one broken, and then all these people trying to use the computer. A lot of them didn’t have cell phones, or they did have cell phones. They don't wanna use the cell phone. Doesn't matter. So. You had to spend time doing that. Once you had those papers done, you make sure they handed you a caseworker, including each week you gave her eight, um, receipts. That shows the amount that you have saved on your bank account. So you, when it's time to move and put it down payment on your, uh, you know, your month's rent and your whatever they, all the stuff they asked for, you have enough. So, of course we did that every week. You know, Rebecca had [inaudible] show support. Which, at the time I wasn’t getting any disability. Nothing. So we were putting money from that. And then they used the rest of the money for their food and whatever. So every week, I would tell my caseworker, “Hey, here I got the, um, the receipt. Because I don’t want to trust you.” So she took it from me, like, maybe twice, but I kept them, instead of my daughter. Um, a week before, two weeks before I got sent here, I got a letter from her office, from her saying that I– I am facing, um, “The danger of being thrown out of the shelter due to nonpayment. You have been here for eleven months and have given zero. Have saved zero amount.” And it was like, “What? How could, zero amount? I, what?” And she's always said, “I trust you.” So I called her and I said, “Um, is this a mistake?”
[00:15:01]
And she said, “No.” I mean, I said, “Diana, are you kidding me? I want my receipts. Do you remember every time you said, ‘Oh, I’ll see it later,’ or, ‘Oh, I trust you’?” I got irate. Irate. Like, [inaudible]
What are you paying for at the shelter?
Well, the state paid, which I didn't know, for me and Christopher, $570 each. I didn’t know this. When the state started saying that they were done, so I was there for almost a year. They should have found me housing. So they found in doubt that I, that they might not be getting anymore money for us, it was like, they were trying to kick us out. And I was like, oh, no you’re not! So I had it, set a meeting with her boss. She had to be calmed down by the social worker that helped me. Because she was having a fit, saying that she wasn't going to be in the same room with me. What the hell did I do to you? Except defend myself. Where the hell am I supposed to go? The street with my son? And start all over again? Are you freaking crazy? Anyway, so I laid out everything in the office. And her boss looked at her. I don't happen after, she was still working afterwards, but I know that she was pissed at her. Can you imagine if I didn’t save that? So anyway. Finally, they have to find me this place. Everyone else had moved here. Everyone else, I sat down with the– with the landlord to get there. I had an idea of what I was going to be paying but never in writing. You're supposed to get all that done before you move here. Never, ‘cause she never set up, but I’m telling you so, because, to them, I was in the street. I was shocked. [inaudible] For the kids. And Daisy helped out all the time. When we started. So. We, um. This is the worst of it all. We are told the day before we have to leave the day– the day of, it was past one o'clock in the afternoon. And they said, “You have to be out of here by 9:00 AM in the morning. This room has to be spotless, clean, with nothing left.” Dan, everybody who left that place, I think maybe one person cleaned that room. They left shit behind. They left garbage. You wouldn't believe. And my room was always clean.
[00:17:57]
They made us move the furniture and clean the back of the furniture. Which I still don’t get why. And I was still having a problem. It was crazy. So we get there, and I said, “What do you mean?” So I didn’t get to say bye to anybody? They wouldn’t let me. It was bizarre. My case worker’s supposed to drive me in her car and come here like an old person. I had to get up, I couldn’t, they had to lift me up to the van ‘cause I couldn’t move my knees yet, and I had to come in one of those, um, construction vans? Because I had to sit in the back with the clothes. It was crazy. And then I get here, and the landlord wasn’t even expecting me yet. So we did everything in a friggin’ rush. Like I said, I didn’t even know what I was paying for yet. It was crazy.
What income do you have right now?
Right now, I have $874, $872 a month.
Through, through what month?
It’s a– a social security, disability. That they literally got in contact with me after I was there for, I think it was four months? Five? I don’t remember. But I know that, um, this guy, Michael Woods, must have looked up my paper. He did the, I don’t know. I don’t know who called, you know? But sometimes, so the guy looked up my paperwork and he, uh, noticed that I would be able to get money, probably. Oh, man. And I got the letter. It wasn’t a short thing yet, but I said, “Oh, God, please.” It was all messed up for real. And I– I looked up the records, and all these things that are still broken and torn? Are still not fixed? And they’re only gonna get worse, you know? Um. But, finally, people are lookin’ at my records after I said for years, why can’t you just go from my records? Not just the mental health. Look at my records, please! So you can see how my journey, and what it is that I needed, and how everything happened. For example, when I got here, they shel– you know, I had seen two apartments, and I picked this one because of the light. I don’t know. It just felt better. But this is supposed to be handicapped. And I could not– can’t, I broke two doors. I hit that one [inaudible] I took it off. But, um, that is, that wheelchair? I can’t run, I can’t go anywhere with the wheelchair. It hits everything. So, what I was trying to get was the scooter. The thin scooter? I forget, but I’m working on it.
[00:21:01]
Because that’s easier. I mean, not for the house, but I told you that, to get out. To at least start moving. Why can’t I? Right? As long as I’m safe. And as long as I can balance myself. But, um, when I got here, it was not. When I started meeting the people, I started wondering. These people seem to have a lot of problems. And I got a little kind of a, weirded out about it. Um, one of the case workers had, had, um, a son, a son. Had told [inaudible] the shelter, I can’t say it. Had told a couple of the girls that went to her about this building, and she said, “you don’t want to move there ‘cause that’s where all the crazy people are. I’m telling you, my kids.” And she said it to me. Okay? I mentioned that to them. I don’t know what happened. But I said, she’s [inaudible] Are you sure you want to go there? But I didn’t think she was serious. Like, I didn’t think it was, this, what we, it’s not like, you understand, the first year here was insanity. People fighting, fighting! Like, breaking walls, windows, pushing each other through windows. They are, one of the guys that attacked me ‘cause he was on friggin’, I don’t know what? Some kind of steroid, something, upper, um, thank God somebody was there to be around me, another tenant. He got to her, too. One of the young men that OD’d that shouldn’t have. That, um. [pause] This is confidential. For now. Right?
[00:23:15]
[END OF RECORDING THREE]
[BEGINNING OF RECORDING FOUR]
[00:00:00]
I know. Moi? It's so sad. So sad, so sad! But I had him, so it doesn't matter. [laughs] You know what I mean? For a long time. So hey, can't complain. My sister and me? That was, look at the bears in the back! [laughs] It was nothing. That was Fourth of July weekend in Wildwood. One of the last ones we ever got together. Christopher and my daughter. Look how cute! Look at these hands! Fast. My pretty mama. In the park that we used to go to all the time. Christopher again in our house with that maple that we had to leave behind. And this is me. I was trying to do the hair today. [laughs] I'm gonna do, like, I should have told them, I think I'm going to next year before and after. I’m gonna blow up pictures, if I could. Do, like this before and after. Wouldn’t that be funny? I'm not kidding. For real, I don't care! Like, and then like, do one of those before and after? I’d win a contest. My daughter wears a dress, not me. Okay, so, listen. I've been sick, right? And I've been through a lot of doing, a lot of stuff to do, and I feel that I still try to get the energy as much as a I can. I have meltdowns, like, the other day and I'm like. You know, I can't. And talking about certain things, well, let me tell you about how I feel like going to this place. Because I've been on the other side, I've been the in, the one that takes the intakes. I've done the intakes, like what they were doing with us. Uh, I did it for, they called it MICA Mental Health, and then for the, um, MICA for the drugs, and then the, holy crap, I forgot the names now. But it was, South Ambrook Hospital had a unit on one of the floors that did mental health, and on the, on the other side was for the drug and a, you know, and all, NAA. And then they had the other for addiction, um, which is NA. But it was a smaller version of it. Then, down the road there was a building that I never worked at. That was more full time, that was more of a, I think they had a, I think they had a methadone clinic. There was spot there, so. Um, I did, when I moved here and I have no job, and they said, “Well, you qualify for the dietary–” I said, “No, no, no.” So I got that job. About three months later, they, um, you know, they brought me up to the office. But once I was in the office, they noticed that I could do other things. I didn’t mind it because I would get out of the office, since I would do the reception, which I loved. I was, like, “Morning!”
[00:03:11]
It was fun. And then I did the operator as well, paging, so I would do funny things, like, “Paging Moby Dick”, and, “I need a Dick”, and, you know, “Anita Dick”, and I got in trouble for that, but, only for a minute. So! [laughs] [inaudible] I was telling Melissa, I went from dietary to assisting with surgery. Isn’t that crazy? Just, I never told you that.
This is while you’re here? I don’t have the context for this. I’m sorry.
When I worked at Elmwood Hospital before they turned into that the nursing place I'm going to, so I'm going back there as a patient, or, you know, a guest, which I thought I was working for? Did Melissa tell you? [laughs] I’m all excited, thinking, “Yes! I’m gonna volunteer, I’m gonna be workin’!” I'm a guest. But it's okay! You know, um, the guy that, one of the guys that interviewed me, he's really sweet and he says, “You know, there’s this extra. I need help. There's some people there are stronger than me.” So I'm not putting it down. And I'll get to know other people and they are helping, you know? So, anyway, I, when I was at Elmwood Hospital, they had no Spanish people back then. Especially, you know, usually it was mostly Jew– well, not even Jewish. I think around this area, I think it was mostly, um, white American, whatever makes Irish. And then they had, um, Polish, a lot of Polish on their boy. So when my sister and I moved here, my parents didn’t go out so much as we did, like, walk around. But we really were like, out of place. The way we dress, the way we talked. So, I’m working at Elmwood Hospital. I even got a write up about it on their newspaper because there was a gentleman who's getting some sort of a gadget, the gadget that does the pulses? Breathes back, like a pacemaker, but you have to be able to tell the doctor where it hurts and all that. Well, even though he was gonna be opened up, face down in the ER, for a certain amount of time, the doctor needed to know exactly where he needed to make sure that the electrical was gonna head. So he had a– a, poked the guy would tell me, he would say, “Oh, there!” you know, whatever, in Spanish. As I’m holding his hand, they ask me if I was, like, had a sore stomach? I said, “No, not really. Not until I saw certain things.” Then, I had get scrubs on and scrub up! And they got me in the ER! You know, that's a no no. But they need it. So I held the guy's hand and I would tell, but that what I started see, which is what they did to me, probably, that way they, they kind of, like your piece of meat, and you, [laughs].
[00:06:28]
The doctor is going, sticking the thing in and the buckets of blood? I was like, I didn’t get sick, but I almost did. When they write me off or something, an employee or whatever, put a beautiful picture up. Two days later, I get a letter. I'm getting fired. Because I wasn’t supposed to be in the ER. No shit, Sherlock. So the doctor had to come and get, make a plead. He was pissed. The man called me for two months praying on the phone with me. He must have been, like, some sort of vet. I don't know man. I don't know what it was, but he prayed with me for like, two months. But they almost fired me, after putting my picture up for employment. The write up and my picture and all that and the story. [laughs] It’s crazy, right? So we're from getting food, to saying hi to people, billing and all that and even being in the surgery room. But I trip, and I get here, and I feel like I’m full of loot. Like I'm in a mental ward. I still do. And it kind of stinks that I don’t feel– Who’s gonna talk to her? I tried. Bad news, ‘cause I’ll get, you know. Some people still do things here. We all know it. [inaudible] Neither does he. But it makes me angry that we’re not in a more– Listen, this is heaven for me. Don't ever get me wrong. Don't, don’t ever think that I don't appreciate it, because I do. Because I couldn't afford it anywhere else. Just got it right now. That’s why I'm trying to, you know, see how I'm gonna get more income so I’ll at least be able to pay more. If I put all mine, who’s gonna charge me eight something for a two bedroom? Who? Nobody! Unless I manage to get my kids to get enough money down or we have enough money for down payment and we’ll have to figure out, because the smartest way would be to do that. And this way they have property left over. Yeah, something. That was the time of my house, but I'm so comfortable. That's what happens when you're in a place for so long and you've been displaced and you don't have enough contact outside.
[00:09:20]
That you start feeling, um, stuck. And I mean stuck, not doing this. I mean stuck, like mentally. And, you know, I mean, Dan, I don't know what neighborhoods are better now. I don't know. So many things have been built in five years. If you don't drive around and, and look around, what do I know? And if I want to go upstate New York, right, I have to go visit. Otherwise, what? Where am I moving? I don't have a clue. I'm giving myself less than two years because can’t stay here forever.
Who’s in upstate New York?
Nobody. I just like it. And there's a bunch of places that I, but now I'm stepping, going away from the warmth. Not that I love the, the way that it is, lady, but I do love the ocean. So I wouldn't mind that, but I mean try to, where? I don't know what’s affordable now. It’s not a buyer’s market. Unless I could hang in there, and, you know. I don’t know. It’s a scary thought when you really don’t know. I mean, not ready to go with me. Even though [inaudible] You think I’m gonna let it go? Nope! And you’ll see what I mean as he gets older. They’re your world. Like, all I’m saying, you know, life. You do. But you don’t. Theirs matters more to me. I matter, but I mean. I know my limits. Like, I wanna go, Eric invited me to to a Halloween party. Could I do it? We'll see. Because, I mean, one thing is for me to want to and then the next thing is, I could go, get up, sit, right? And, but if I sit there all night, the worst thing to do. Let me show you something. [inaudible] ‘cause I’m sure she’s got small feet. And I’ve got big feet. [laughs] How adorable, right? This is the kid in me, kid. You didn’t know I have kids shoes, I’m just saying. And I follow [inaudible] But, this is why I think I have all this stuff going on. See, if you look at it, a lot of stuff is very, kind of, not, I don’t know, maybe infantile? I don’t wanna say, but, young maybe, or, fantasy kind? That’s where I always went to. And I still do. I still watch some, couple of [pots banging] really good ones, Blood Moon last night. Check that one out. It’s on Netflix. A hot movie, but good. Not hot, but good. Very bizarre. I’ve never seen a movie like that. It’s this new girl, I think she’s Korean, and the other people you’ll know, the other actors. And I wasn’t sure what to expect, but I enjoyed it. And I don't know if you saw Swiss Army Man?
[00:12:53]
Did you see that, yet? Oh, my God. What did I do? What, you got to. Daniel Radcliffe. Weird, but, like, you have to see it. It's so, nothing that's ever been done before. I’m a big, big, big film buff. Like crazy, crazy. I'll see the, I saw the best Alfred Hitchock movie. Never thought that I, not, I don't know how I didn't see this. It's one of the, maybe the first ones. It's so good, they even have that without little dollies. In this dream sequence, they have some of those dollies, paintings. I can't remember the damn name. Assemble, that’s a thing [laughing, inaudible] But I tried to like them. And I saw Bombshell. That was really good, about the election. Do you remember the election when Trump, when Rupert– when all those people got murdered? My God, Charlize Theron is unrecognizable. She looks like the anchor. Like, I couldn't believe it anyway. Anyway, anyway. Got sidetracked. Um. Blood Moon, I'm gonna start sending you links. Not a lot. Only the good ones. Because the Alfred Hitchcock one, I can't believe I never saw it. And it's, um, it's with Ingrid Bergman. Okay? And, um, Robin Mitchell. We play, oh, she plays a psychiatrist. Okay? And that's what I'm gonna say. And he pretends to be one, and then we go into what happened. I've never, it feels very smart, but I– I can't believe what I saw. It’s the name of the asylum. So, I don't know the name right now. Um, what else could I tell you when I got here? How I got here. I got here by me pushing it and asking constantly. He had me doing crazy.
[00:15:06]
Imagine being there? They would tell us the date and they would not come. Another date, they will not come and then either, but you told me, I said, “No. They told me that.” Um. It was very difficult. I, for many reasons, getting no play– I told you about that you can go on the weekends. You had to sign a book. So I would sign it every weekend, hoping that maybe, or try to sign it when I found out. But I never– I got out twice the entire time I was there. That is horrible. Because other people have people that can come get them. My daughter had no car at the time because that had gotten totaled. Another one that got totaled– not totaled, but she couldn’t afford to fix it. So her dad used to give her, thank God for that. Not my ex, her dad used to give her, my husband took a ride until he helped her get a used one between her and him. She just got herself an, the car, a Volkswagen sedan. It's cute as heck. I didn’t know they were that nice. So. I'm having a struggle with, um, where to go. And there's more, but it kind of comes as I talk. You know? Like, there's so much that had to do with the way I was raised and, and how I, why I handle the things I handle the way I did, or how my body, my mind was able to handle it. And also the difference between him and I, that I was used to things happening, you know, more, even though, don't get me wrong, these guys didn't have a good last three years because of the chaos in the house that you don't realize is happening, or you do, but you don't realize how you need to. Why do you, one of you needs to. Just swallow it, I guess you know, and just not let it get out of control because of his heart. Let me tell you, when somebody's doing something to the point that you're like, “Oh my God, why did you do that? Why? I mean. Did you not think?” I mean, there's so much personal things that affect the way you act and the things you do and what you're passionate about in your life. That's why I say to you that I want to, I have to be able to give back and help others. And I think that one of the biggest things, and I'm not the only one who feels that way, that the age that meets so badly right now are the young adults. More than anybody could say. Because the younger kids are getting more help. There's a date.
[00:18:10]
There's an age. [clears throat] I think up to 8, maybe 7? 7 and below. Maybe it’s less than that. Who knows. That I think people are looking at you. I think it's 6, maybe. Then I don't know what happens, but from 7 and 12, you're in this limbo land and it's still happening unless you get lucky with, you know, you know, you have your, your parents are constantly, whose working at the school, what school they’re going to. You know, all that matters. He had a– a teacher that would spend time with him even when she didn’t need to. Extra help teacher. He didn't need anymore. She was wonderful. She had the most beautiful heart, probably around your age now you know. Younger. Um, also, the, um, I think that from 12? Or should I say 15, right? Or junior year. From junior year to like 24? Or 23? These kids are lost. I’ve seen way too many of them. If I don't get out–
These are the kids from here?
Yeah, here, here and I’ve seen in streets and I, and they've told me themselves in conversation and I'm like, I've told them in a group and I– I said to, I need to speak to Eileen about that, McConnell [sic], (editor’s note: again, Eileen O’Donnell). And ask her [clears throat] to help me get in touch with whoever because I know one of– one of the people from the meeting that we had, that big meeting with all the different people from different groups and stuff, agencies. Um, one of the girls handles that age group, at least one of them, and she gave me a card, and I don't know where it went. I think it was left on the bottom of one of the bags and it was thrown out, and I do. I do remember what she looks like, but I don't remember her name. I know. So, I’ve got to talk to Eileen and ask her, because if I don't keep on top of this, it's gonna just go on another year and nothing's gonna be done about it and it can’t wait. It’s bad. I mean, and it’s, and it's not gonna get better if they don’t get help now. Because my two other ones, he wouldn’t get help before 25. And they're doing much better. But if they would have been out of the 24, I don't know about that. You know? I think that's the time that your brain starts kind of twisting another way. And if you don't feel secure enough, and strong enough to kind of take a chance, do something, you know, be true. Believe in yourself. Screw everybody else.
[00:21:16]
‘Cause you’re gonna have a lot of people that are gonna hate on you no matter what, and they're gonna talk crap. There's always gonna be bullies. But, um. Yeah, they need connections and I don't know how. It's not just that face. You know? Right? How are you gonna survive without doing that? I mean, you gotta be a little concerned for your little guy, he, that's why you need to fight for everything that you can now, ‘cause he's got time. And I think that's gonna be a better generation than– than the– this one and the one being the one after like the younger one. Like [redacted]. He’s so nervous all the time. So I don't know what to do. But I struggle with being heard, um, in general here. Um, I feel, I told you. I feel like even maintenance, um, well, when they came in here with like, that notion of like, I mean. You know? Why would you do that? And I've only been nothing but respectful to this man. Like I am to everybody. Like, why the fuck would you do that to me?
Who are you referencing?
About making fun of me. That I was crazy. You can't do that, honey. You know? And then telling me, he went and complained to Bonnie that I was screaming across the, screaming outside. Trying to get his attention. Yeah, I was. Because I separated, everything straightened out for him to come fix something twice and he didn't call. Things happen, but at least let me know! Because, just courtesy, you know? And I was asked that I had to be here, so, I mean. What the heck? Then, um, “I got you. I got you.” I– I was waiting for my– I wanted to open the window and not have the electricity going out for no reason, right? They complain about that. They put this screen on my window so I don't get bugs in here. It doesn't take any time. So, I had three months waiting for the screen. Oh, I got it. Yeah, I got it. I know you got it. But that was the day that I said, “Can you please, the inspector failed my apartment.” Do you know what happens when they fail your apartment?
[00:23:59]
Do you know what happens? DCA, you know who DCA is? From, DCA is, um, I don't know what it stands for, I forget, but it's the people who give the voucher, whatever object you're going to get, and they give you the certain amount of money to the state. And then they come up, they basically add up what you earn, your income is. They don't even, to put expenses is almost useless, okay? It has to be pretty serious, which is rare. So even if you need a list, even if you get food stamps, let's just say. Nobody's gonna, you gotta come up with money for cleaning, for toilet papers, here. Just basic stuff, you know? Um, Tylenol now. What do you call anything to cover yourself, for bad things? It doesn't matter. Anything extra that does happen, you need it. Doesn't cover food. Thank God for that, but not water. And not, I don't get that. They do cover soda. No water. So, and no prepared foods. That's fine. Fine with that. You know that's fine. But not to cover cleaning supplies and toilet paper? So what do you do? Anyway, you have to try to get it or get some. Beg, ask. I know sounds terrible, but you have to be constantly, you know, and I hate it, Dan. I hate it. I feel like, yeah, like, like I'm like one of those, like, freeloaders. And I know that I asked for it when I need it, but it sucks. It's. I still haven't gotten used to it. I could never get used to it. You know they have that, um, food stamps, and I said, “um, let me try to do without it.” Because I've, that was my thinking. Because there's so many new people that are gonna need it. Because there are, and it's a waiting list probably. I don't know, I didn’t hear anything about it yet. Because the state gave money, so maybe not. But, um, let somebody else get it, right? I can't afford it without it. I can't. It's just not enough. Then I can't save any money at all, not even $10. And they wanna do a– a meeting. It's about me setting up a payment plan to pay more rent than I'm paying with money. My money, which I already– I didn't get it, but they got it. They just have to apply it to my account. How many times do you have to say that it's showing the emails? I don't have the check, of course.
[00:27:00]
That's not my place to have. I don't even know how much they gave. But trust me, with enough to cover whatever, whatever they said I own that I didn't, by the way. I don't know how to handle that. And then they tell you, “Well, it will go to court. The court expenses are on you.” I'm like, okay. But I didn't do anything wrong. I didn't. And I, like I said to you, I kept on paying extra just so they don't say that I'm not paying anything even though I already paid. Why don’t they add up what I owe? The extra amount? How many times do I have to say that? Am I doing something wrong, that I’m not speaking clear? ‘Cause I think I am. I show them the, um, Melissa sent house, uh, DCA, everybody the number that, that, everything is well, we have the file, I have a, you know, a thing where I save my files. I don't lose any of it. I forget things. But I don't lose, like, I keep. You know what I mean? Thank God for that. I had to find, otherwise I didn’t know how to approve. And do I want to go to court? No! That's like going against them. But why are you fighting something with me that is not, I– I swear to God I'm baffled by this and I don't know what to do and that the first two times that I, not this year, the time before. When they said that to me, I thought I was having a nervous breakdown, an anxiety attack. I was on my way to the doctor. Alice. My heart was about to pop out of my chest because I had no idea. I'm like, what? You know when you, uh, have this panic about losing? You know, being in the streets or losing everything, it triggers you. And it's like I finally was able to detach it. It upsets me when I go in there. But because, like, I'm saying something, and, “Oh, we– we gotta do this the way we do it.” Okay? But what is it that you're doing that is right? I get that this is what you do when people are, you're in the right to do that. But what is my excuse? What is my, what's going on here? And how many times do I need to ask that and I don't get a question, and answer back? Just because that's everybody. No! Not everybody. That's not true! Not everybody got that letter. So. What's happening?
[00:30:01]
I know you don't know what to say. Makes me uneasy. No matter how much I tried it not to. Every time that I'm done, give it up. Two weeks and I start all over again with this crap. Don't know, honey. Don’t know. But they gave me the new oven, thank God. Barely had time to clean the back. Standing there, watching the two guys help me. And. Give me some cleaner that's gonna take that nasty, there's drops on the back of it that we had at least there of grease. That could create a fire. Grease this thick. But I got the broiler to work and I got everything working. So maybe this year could make something for holidays, which is nice. And also, that has to be replaced also. The hood. [laughs]. I look, I feel I look horrible. You got me looking, like, from up here, you know? You know what that is? You're fat and your nostrils. You know that, right? You got the nose, and then. Oh my God. No, but really. Hold on, hold on. Ow, ow, this little, stupid cat. It's for the dishes. But it's like felt. It's the worst. So I put it off because, okay, listen, ow. Like. [a loud whirring noise] Isn’t that sweet? Imagine cooking with that. [laughs] Oh my God. I'm telling you, I’ve complained on this. It’s big. Because I've tried to do, like, I need to. Those things need to be clean and I’m gonna have to end up doing it because of. Do you have a– a air purifier for the baby yet? I'm gonna get you one. For the, for the, no no no no.
We have one for the– for the house. We just don't have one in his room.
[very far away]I tested this table. It’s affordable. Sorry, but it’s hard. Because I read, I spent time reading, uh, reviews. You don’t know how much I– I look into it before I even put money into it. Because I can't afford to waste the money. This is not a fancy– I cannot tell you how much that I've been sleeping. And no stuffiness, nothing. So he needs one for his room, too. They have bigger ones, but it's good to have in his room. They have, like, the same, these, but they have one like for, like, well, babyish, but you don't need babyish, need something that's gonna work good, and I think this is only like $30 and I was like “What?” On sale.
[00:33:39]
But, um, and you just have to, you know, you can put some oil if you want, but you don't need to. And it's easy as hell. All you have to do is plug it in and it’ll start. They have white and black. What color is good? White, or black? No. Listen. Or, or what does he like? It's the baby, that he doesn't. He's not you. It's not your wife. It's the baby. What is he into? Don't make me angry, because Christmas is coming. You’re gonna have to say it. I'll figure it out.
Gigi, thank you. We're totally okay.
No.
We have one.
You know what? What my mother got Christopher, and now they have them. They only had them in QVC, and they were, like, a hit. I'm not gonna tell you what they are. And if you have them already, the more you have, the better. So, I know what. They won't get hurt. I know. Non-toxic. No. Trust me. All that. Okay, so. [sigh] Oh, honey, I don't know. I mean. I don't, you have to maybe kind of think about what you want. Not want– what you think is important, that gets out there, or that you want to get out of the story. You know, in general. So that I can maybe, and I can talk to my daughter. She's the writer, so she can send me an– an ideas on how to, like, get it out. That's what, that's my problem, is that it's, sometimes I– when I start thinking about things, it gets in here and then I don't, I go there and I go there and I start kind of moving because I stuff, flip it, like getting nervous about saying certain things. And upset and it's, it’s sick. You get so tired of crying. It's not funny. It's like, you get sick of it. I cry when I'm happy too, by the way. I'm happy, when I’m angry, when I'm sad. I'm an emotional mess and it’s not because I’ve been like that all my life. I'm not crying all the time, I’m saying that. I'm very, I don’t know. So. [sigh]
[00:36:15]
I'm trying to figure out what my next move is gonna be, because, um, five years have gone by that I moved here. And it feels like it was months ago. I'll tell you what, everybody does go through this very bizarre feeling, not a good feeling when they first move. It's like this decompression, I think, they have to go through. And it takes about two months. It's very strange, but everybody went through it. Like, all of a sudden, all that tension needed to start getting, I hope, but we wouldn't know how. And it was very strange. So, I, you know what I wanna know? I wanna know why they don't have a mental health specialist of some kind come in here. You know, there are people, because of all places, this place when all those still benefit tremendously. Any place with, you know, with a large, um, number of people that, that have certain things. I mean, think about it. And also. I don't know, you are out there more, maybe you can, you know someone that might want to work with younger people. And– and them being able to express whatever it is that they haven't been able to. Because most of them don't wanna tell it. You could just hop on them when you try not to get there, but I'm just letting you know that it's, it's gonna be a serious, serious thing. Most people become older and become better for society. And what are we gonna have? A gentle frickin’ psychopath walkin’ around? That's, that's serious. If this doesn't get the attention that it needs. And I don't think it takes a lot. It takes you somebody who is gonna take time to hear you. Many times. Somebody that's not, you know, that's not connected to the same, that you can get out with, you know? I don't know. I don’t know. I don’t know what to say now, anymore. I'm kind of drained. Like, yeah. Kind of like, yeah. I’m drained. So, I think that maybe next, I'm gonna do the same thing with Rebecca. But if you talk to your wife. Maybe you have. Ask her. You know, does it matter, God, that you know, there's things that happen to me. As a mother. As a woman. That affected the way that I am, to this, and that others don’t, or my past might have helped me, that maybe others can benefit from, you know, knowing certain things. Ask her! I’m sure she’s smart. And from a woman’s perspective, you might not be thinking the same things that she is about. That I can tell you.
[00:39:52]
Does that make any sense? Like, if you wouldn't talk, it's different, because you could be kind of going back and forth with certain things that you can think maybe the same about. But we, no matter what, no matter how sensitive you are, no matter how nice you are, we think that differently. No matter what, you know, no matter how hard we try. And, so I'm better than others, obviously, but it's still different. So maybe, let's come up with different something, that. That would be worth reading. You know? That is important, not just. I mean, everything. Let's make this right. And I don't know how to do it. [pause] And you sit there and you look at me like what? I don't know what you want me to say. [laughs] I don't know. I need ideas. Questions. Not made-up stuff. I mean ideas. I was also used to paying very high up on one point of my life. Harry. And that was great. I stopped telling my stories. Because other people thought I was full of. That's okay, I know it. I know the truth. And the pictures, and I was, whatever, still in touch with some of those people. But I met very interesting people in my life. That also give you advice.
[00:41:40]
It doesn't matter where you come from, everybody's got problems. So. Thing is, how do you survive feeling no bliss? And the answer is, there's no answer. There's no way, except you getting up and moving. And have, making yourself get out the house, even if it's twenty minutes a day. Or are you gonna be in trouble. I've been there. And it's a men’s world, still. And it’s rough when you're a woman in this kind of situation. It’s even worse. It's better to be, like, blend in which I never know how to do well. You know, and no one realizing who you are, like, one of those, you know, come in and out. And, “Oh, there’s Gigi!” It’s not good. Because that makes people talk to and then make up stuff. It’s weird. And it's weird, being an old lady in a wheelchair and people talking shit about me. Kind of sad. Um, [redacted]. And they, and I got a great doctor. But I told you, I had to get a loan to get a doctor. He saved my freaking ability to stand and walk. And now the pain on the back like that, that's crazy. I don't have any back pain. None. When I couldn’t move. You know what that means? The guy knew what the heck he was doing. ‘Cause everything hurts me. Because these are not real. But this one. I can't take this off. No, look. So, kid, I think I'm done. I wish I could do more.
[00:44:46]
[END OF RECORDING FOUR]