Katura Williams

Katura Williams has experienced an abusive home life several times in her life. She has had a substance abuse disorder and served a five year prison sentence for assault. She is now certified in culinary arts, but is stuck in New Brunswick because of car issues. She is utilizing the resources at Elijah’s Promise until her car can be fixed so that she can go home.

“I always had so much going on for myself and I think my family had a lot of faith in me, like I was gonna make a change in this family.”
— Katura Williams

Annotations

1. Child Abuse - Pennsylvania's Child Protective Services Law states individuals who are required to report suspected child abuse, commonly known as mandated reporters. Among those explicitly listed are school nurses. The law also states that any person not specifically listed in the law is permitted to file such a report if they have reason to believe there is an occurence of child abuse.
2. Foster Care - Pennsylvania's Child Protective Services Law was amended in 1994 to include section 6373. General protective services responsibilities of county agencies. This section dictates that agencies must make reasonable efforts prior to the placement of a child in foster care to prevent or eliminate the need for removal the child from their home and to make it possible for the child to return home. Earlier versions of this law, first passed in 1985, do not include this section.
3. Education - Schools in communities of low socio-economic status are often underresourced, having negative effects of students' academic progress and outcomes. Despite federal efforts to assist schools in low income areas through bills such as the Elementary and Secondary Act and its subsequent reauthorizations, Pennsylvania still struggles to provide equitable funding due to a lack of enrollment based funding policy, which exacerbates inequities that increased during the 1970s and 1980s.
4. Mental Health - There are many barriers to access that prevent people from seeking and receiving care for their mental health, such as high cost or inadequate insurance coverage, clinician shortage, and a lack of funding and facilities. Mental health services become less accessible when individual income level is factored in. Of Americans that have not sought mental health treatment 53% were in low-income households.
5. Teen Pregnancy - Programs, such as Lehigh Valley Children's Centers, a program in Allentown, PA similar to the one Katura describes, provide child care and early childhood education for children of teen parents. Access to these services helps teen parents continue and complete their education. Teen pregnancy and parenting both contribute highly to high school drop out rates among girls. About 53% of girls who gave birth as teens received their high school diploma, compared to 90% of girls who did not give birth and received their diplmoa.
6. Addiction and Domestic Violence - Programs, such as Lehigh Valley Children's Centers, a program in Allentown, PA similar to the one Katura describes, provide child care and early childhood education for children of teen parents. Access to these services helps teen parents continue and complete their education. Teen pregnancy and parenting both contribute highly to high school drop out rates among girls. About 53% of girls who gave birth as teens received their high school diploma, compared to 90% of girls who did not give birth and received their diplmoa.
7. Incarceration and Education - Re-entry into the labor market poses a significant challenge for newly released prisoners. Opportunities for education and job training reduce re-incarceration and help former inmates secure employment and reintegrate into society. The Florida Department of Corrections provides 91 CTE (career and technical education course) in 36 different vocational trades.
8. Incarceration and Employment - Agencies like the one Katura describes provide job services and employment assistance to ex-offenders by helping to remove the barriers to obtaining work. These services, such as those offered at New Jersey's One Stop Career Centers, can include employment referrals, driver's license restoration, referrals to community mental health programs, job search preparation classes, and access to Workforce Learning Link resources.
9. Drug Related Crime - As of 2004, 17% of state prisoners and 18% of federal inmates said they committed their current offense to obtain money for drugs. Harm reduction practices aim to decrease the negative outcomes associated with criminalized activites, such as drug use. Such practices uphold the safety of individuals engaging in an activity, rather than trying to end or prevent it, and help reduce the harm of the activity, such as crime and contact with the criminal justice system.

TRANSCRIPT

Interview conducted by Dan Swern

New Brunswick, New Jersey

February 14, 2020

Transcription by Amanda Bruce

Annotations by Grace Hazen

This is Dan Swern, I am here at Elijah’s promise on Nielson Street it is Friday, February 14th at 12:26 pm and I am here sitting with…

Katura

Last name please?

Williams

Katura thank you um so uh this is again uh your show so just please start from the very beginning?‌

KW: Um well I was born December 11, 1980. Um my mother, her name is Easter, Easter wallace. My family we lived down here in the projects 176 Memorial Park Way. Um. But my mom she used to have like she had a lot of uh.. Mental health issues and you know drug and alcohol issues. So I kind of like was left with my grandmother a lot. Um.. but my grandmother was a christian woman so I would go to church a lot with her and she was just really good to me you know um.. But then a part of me still always had a desire to have my mother around, but she was just too busy running the streets you know. My father.. Um was incarcerated when I was little, when I was a baby. He had actually uh caught a murder charge so I had never met my father up until that time. Um….erm...um...um so like my mom she just kinda she was like really bad like with pills and stuff so she used to like um… [inaudible] she would kinda like sell me or whatever but uh i don't really remember too much but i know it smells, like my senses pick up and I kinda have like a slight flashbacks as you call it, like certain things come back.  Sometimes you know the things that traumatizes you I guess your brain just shut it down and like you don't want to remember. Anyway, so my grandmother knew what was going on, and I never said anything and by the time I was like, seven, my mom got off the street, she got herself together, she got clean, she met this great guy um named Jimmy, he moved her to Baltimore Maryland, and um so my grandma wounded up taking me to them, um by the time I was eight years old saw them by the projects at the age of eight. Started going to the school there started elementary um and then one time with my mom and my stepfather things kinda like took a turn, my step father was very abusive and my mom never told anybody the stuff he was doing to her, um and then once I came into the picture she would allow him to abuse me too. And… um, I pretty much just learned how to survive through abuse.  Um so I stayed with them, bouncing around going from Baltimore to York Pennsylvania. I wasn't  really allowed to have like friends because I guess he felt like his secret would come out, the closer people got to me he probably thought his secret would come out so he didn't want to take the chance on exposing who he was. However this guy was like a children's youth minister in the church. It was a twisted situation. Because the church is supposed to be a place where you have a safety net and a lot of times you have all kind of people doing all kind of things to kids in these places anyway, so, but he taught me alot too. Like, he taught me how to cook he was a chef and I kinda grew to love cooking as a little girl um...I draw, I draw very well. Um so he like, he..he pushed the issue of me uh.. If he seen I had a gift, he pushed it. Music wise, drawing wise,  cooking, those things that he’d seen that were my interests and my gifts he made sure that I always practiced and that I always did it. So it was kinda like uh… it was crazy ‘cause how could somebody that does so much evil could turn around and do so much good it just was weird. It just was weird.

Um.. so I stay with my mother and her husband up until about the age of twelve. And how I got free out of that abusive situation was that one day I had gone to school and the nurse needed to take some vital signs or something, but I think the people might have expected something--but you know when you’re a kid you don't know these things but now thinking back as an adult now they might have expected something because the way this happened this day was just different because nobody would really say anything even the neighbors, they’d hear me screaming and no one would call the cops it was like, back then everybody was like hush-hush nobody would say anything. So, the nurse uh took my uh had me roll up my sleeves and was doing my blood pressure and she had seen a couple of bruises on my arms or whatever and she had asked me what had happened and um as scared as I was I just, you know I told her I had got a beating and she said why and I remember putting my head down and just saying because I was being bad, and I wasn’t a bad girl. I wasn’t I listened, and just he put that inside of my head to make every little thing that I did you know just.. he really just try to-- he really was breaking me all the way down. Self esteem, the way that I looked at myself how i felt about myself as a woman, always said I was ugly and like just everything like the way he treated me. And then he confused me about my sexuality, you know what I’m saying so it was like… I don’t know but.

[Annotation 1]

So anyway, so the nurse had seen my scars and she asked me If I had anymore...or whatever, and I think I started just crying and um.. She uh she eventually had me go in the bathroom and take my shirt off she came in the bathroom and she looked at my body I don't think she had permission I don't think she had the right to do that but I think she just went off natural instincts and just caring, you know just being a person that cared. You know she was probably overstepping her boundaries working in the system you know the way she was working you know to take me in there and have me do that you know.. So when she seen all the marks I have she was like oh my God, I remember her saying that. I put my shirt on and she told me to sit down and I remember she was taking so long the only thing I could worry about, if I’m not ho-- because he timed me, he used to time me. He knew the time that I got out of school I had this certain amount of time to make sure I was inside of that  house. You know so, I remember sitting there and the only thing I could think about is that I’m going to get in trouble because I’m not gonna be home on time because she’s taking too long.

She said don't worry about it, and I’m crying and I’m upset because she wont let me go home and I’m gonna get in trouble. Um. she said you’re not going back. I really got scared then, I’m not going back? I’ve been so used to it for so many years. What do you mean I’m not going back? I learned how to live through it, it became a part of my norm after a while you know. 

 Um. So uh… these people came or something, I think they were like children or youth and they took me to this building and at this time I was living in York, In York Pennsylvania, and they took me to this building and I remember downtown it was this small building, it was nice too. And I’m sitting in one of those cubicles and everything around I remember I was sitting there, and they asked me if I knew anybody that I can call, that will come get me. So I told them- I gave them my grandmas name, I don’t know if I knew her number or not, I don’t know how everything came about, but what wind up happening was that my father’s a tractor trailer driver--my grandfather he was--God bless him he’s passed away now, He was a tractor trailer driver, so some way some how they got in contact with my nana and my grandfather and my um grandmother and a couple people from the church I used to go to when I was a little girl-- now that was a good church. The church that my stepfather was at, (inaudible) but the one I went to with my grandma the people were great there. Um there was like my second home. But um, so they took me back to New Jersey, but they wind up having to bring me back because, I guess I belonged to the system now, at that time, and uh she had to fight for me in court, you know. Um so they wound up putting me in foster care uh I had my foster mom and dad Leila and Bob Fosco um. They had their own restaurant called Alberta’s Italian Restaurant, they was real good people, they were so nice. I gave my foster mom so much hell [laughs], it was like everything that I was feeling I took it out on her-- I love both of them, really, but I think I just gave her so many problems because she was like the disciplinary, and I always just had to listen to everything and once I got away, I just got wild, I don’t know it was like a wild animal, I didn’t know how to act [laughs]. So, but she was patient with me, she was very patient, she would come sit down and talk to me try to figure out what's going on, she knew that I had been through a lot so she really was just patient.

[Annotation 2}

Um..the school that I went to, I was able to take french class um uh french lessons, I learned French I learned german, spanish. Can’t speak it fluently but I learned it and that's the beauty about it, being able to experience these types of things you know. Um.. I definitely learned swimming. I had swimming lessons. And I came from the projects, we wasn’t having no swimming lessons down there (laughs) you know. And um thats the-- that's the first time I remember that was the first time I have seen like a cabin style home. Oh my God it was just so beautiful. Because they were like um in a there were the time where they had er a cabin, in the mountains, that they’d take the family--the girls to, all of us because it was six of us, and we was all different races. It was funny, you should've seen the house, it was a show, right. And um, we would go snow-mobiling, and it just was really really nice it was just such a different experience and I felt so loved you know like. It was kinda weird because I did get teased a lot because the school I went to was majority white people, so I did get you know my fair share of being teased, but that was alright because the people treated me good, you know ki-kids can be cruel anyway. Um, they didn't know any better I don't think they were just doing what they thought they should and what they were taught, you know.

[Annotation 3}

Um… but I started fighting a lot, I noticed that then, back then once I got away from my step father, I became very violent. Like that's how uh um… I felt like somebody would do something that would break my heart, I’m such a sensitive soul you know what I’m saying, like I will retaliate with violence towards that person. And um… I don’t know but my foster mom tried to get me help you know, once I was there-- and I say tried because I stopped going to the… to the doctor..uh, it was like therapy. I would have to go.. ‘Cause this guy, would sit there and the way he used to stare at me just like I didn't feel comfortable. And he would always ask me about the sexual part of what my stepfather was doing-- I think something was wrong with the man, now looking back, he would keep having me repeat the same thing, like, and I told him, I don’t wanna talk about that. I remember when I left I told my foster mom I wasn’t going back no more, I wasn’t going because I didn’t want to talk about it. She said, tell me Katura you gotta get that out, you gotta talk about it..we’re trying to get you help. You know… I wasn’t trying to hear it I wasn’t trying to go back and I didn’t go back. And so, needless to say I’ve never got professional help for what I've experienced, so. And I started growing up, I stayed in foster care until I was about.. Thirteen. It wasn’t long I only stayed there for a little over a year, almost two years, um my grandma finally got custody of me she finally won custody. And I came out here, I came back to New Brunswick and you could just imagine how I was talking. They called me a white girl out here (Laughs), you know it was hard, it was like, I couldn't please nobody. Over here, I’m too black, but In my own culture I'm too white, i'm so. 

[Annotation 4]

‌Katura How old were you when you came back to New Brunswick? 

I was… Thirteen? I was thirteen when I came back. Um, my grandma lived up here by this place called the countr-- back then It was called the Country Inn, I guess it was like a strip club or like uh, you know just a regular club, people would go, get hi-- not, hmm no people probably got high there too. But it was like a strip club. Um, she lived right by there and at that time.. Uh, I used to go to school there called McKinley up 27. And um, when I used to walk by this one building it was called 912 somer- it was 912 Somerset Street, this building there was this one boy who would always have his head out the window, and he would always wink at me and blow me kisses, all the time. And it just (laughs), it was just, I don’t know it made me uncomfortable but he would do it all the time every day, so I kinda started looking forward to it… like no one was paying me no attention I was so scrawny, you know like no chest no nothing, just like a stick I was real flat no nothing front and back. So, I used to just wear my hair in a ponytail back so I was just a plain plain girl. And uh.. One day he came outside and asked me if he can um walk me to school.

His name was Terrance, Terrance um Milnd, but they called him Q, so. Um.. He would walk me to school sometimes he would me me at the school and pick me up, he was 16, so um. After a while you know we would just walk and talk he just kinda made his business like to kinda spend time with me, we wasn’t like dating, it was just like he’d come and talk to me ‘cause he wanted to sleep with me. Because you know theyre young or whatever but I wasn’t a fast girl, especially being that I’ve had experiences with sex in such a negative- I wouldnt say negative, but such a negative way that my body did exactly what it was supposed to do--it responded, but it wasn’t what I wanted. Do you get what I’m saying? I don’t know, its messed up. So anyway, um, he used to always ask me when I’m going to let him… whatever whatever you know and I was like “I’m scared!” (laughs) whatever. Anyway, it happened one day and uhm, he was actually the first guy that I willingly gave myself to, so I felt like, the way that I was taught, I didn’t feel like I was a virgin still but they used to tell me they used to say Katura you remain a virgin until you give yourself away, and I didnt see it like that, ‘cause I was already violated so. 

Um But anyway, I wound up being with Q, erm… One day it was around his birthday time--he’s a Christmas baby, um I had came to visit him and at this time I had already left, my grandma had sent me to live with my aunt in South River because I was sneaking out going to his house and they didn’t-- my family didn’t approve of me dealing with Q, because they didn’t like him, they knew he was no good like. I dont wanna say that-- he was just young, you know. But he wasnt--I deserved better, he wasn’t good for me you know, and at that time anyway I didnt really have any (inaudible) with anybody and the focus was always school and stuff. But anyway I went over there, we had sex, left, not too long after I found out I was pregnant. Not only was I pregnant, but he gave me an STD. So here I was, age 14 now, pregnant, got an STD from this guy, scared to death, um, everything.

So uh his mom, they’re west Indian they’re from Guyana, his mom started going with me to the doctors just cause he he just was after me he would chase the next tail. Uhm, she would take me to the doctors and help me out and you know we cleared up the STDs and got medicine and all of that and I was all distraught you know and everything. Uh, August 25, 1995 I had Nijer, Nijer Kaishon Williams, has my heart. He’s now 24. Um the--the nurses and everybody came to me and was telling me they could find him a nice home for him because they felt like I needed to continue my education and everything and they felt it would not be healthy for me trying to raise a child being so young. Uh but I went against it I told them I wanted him, and I kept him. And me and Nijer went to school together. I went to my class, I took him to his little class, he had like a little daycare but it was inside the school I went to in Pennsylvania, My Grandmother allowed me-- now by this time, by the time I was pregnant. Um I kinda skipped a lot but by the time I was pregnant, my mom was trying to build a relationship back with me. Okay, but I wasn't supposed to be around her until I was 18. She was not allowed-- see I don’t tell on my mom. Oh damn I forgot everythi--I didn't tell you the whole thing about that. Its okay alright, so I’ma just wrap this up right here now. My step father wound up going to prison behind what he did to me. Him and my mom separated. My mom got angry because she felt like I split her family up. So she didn't talk to me for a while, but after a while she ended trying to come back into the picture and try you know, whatever. 

So, here I am, I'm pregnant, my--my-- mom tells my grandmother if you seen Katura out here with me she was living around Allentown, sitting around here with me there's a school for women with children she can go to, so she can finish school, et cetera et cetera so I went, and thats how me and Nijer wound up going to the same school. But it was so cute, so I wanted to ge-- by the time I was 16 or 15 or something my mom signed some working papers for me. I went and got me a job. I kept going to school, um after school, my mom would meet me at the bus stop, she would take the baby, I would hop on the next bus and I’d go straight to work I was working at kids foot locker in Lehigh Valley Mall in Allentown and I did that until I graduated school, got my high school diploma. Um, and then kinda like after that, I don’t know I kinda just. I had signed up at this one school to go for visual communications but I kinda fell off. I met this other guy who was like 13 years older than me, Benjamin. Oh God.. (Laughs). Ben was a family friend, he was the older guy that was a family friend. And uh my family didn’t approve of that either. They couldn’t stand the fact that-- well he--you know when we started dating he was like-- he was like really nice to me I thought, he’d open the car doors for me, take me out, you know, kinda like spoil me, wine and dine me. You know things like that. And so I liked it, and Um, I started messing with him, or whatever, but it was like after a while after that, he became very possessive over me, um.. He didn't want me working. Cause I think I had gotten me a jo-- another job now I was working at the route 18 flea market cause I had--once I finished school and everything coming back I came back to Jersey--I’ve been bouncing back and forth forever it was like. Um.. so he uh come to find out he was getting high, he was doing heroin. But he covered it up really good. Like, he worked for the state and everything. Covered this shit up like you couldn't tell that this man was a junkie. 

[Annotation 5]

‌You know.. He had everybody thinking he was this good guy but the hell he wasn’t. And um… so one day we was in the house and uh he used to always ask me if I wanted to try and I remember the first time he asked me that I had like damned and cursed because I was like you say you love me why would you offer me something like that. You know and i had never did any har- I never did any drugs or nothing like that you know. Sometimes I’d get dru-- drink me a beer or something like (inaudible) to get me drunk. You know I was a lightweight (laughs). So, um anyway I wind up doing some with him one day, and after that my life did a whole 360. That day I lost myself. Um… I was 19 uh he wanted me to just keep me in the house.. Like.. it just was.. He was just.. I don't know. Anyway.

So, after a few months or so of doing that, I had caught--It probably happened before then but I had caught a really really bad habit, but being that he supplied the drugs all the time and by this time I was living in Irvington with him, uh uh East Orange Ave right by Springfield Ave so we wasn’t too far from Newark we weren't too far from the projects so we would go down to the projects and get doubles. And he would always do that and we’d go to the house and he would just keep it there and go out do whatever but he did-- I wasn’t allowed out of the house without him. So, um, I wound up becoming really addicted.. Addicted to dope um.. The top of my nose became so black from just snortin’ snortin’ snortin’ so much my cousin seen me one day, I was out here on George Street I remember.. Because my family didn't know what I was doing if-- they didn’t know, they knew I was with him but they didn't know really what was going on because I hid it because I was ashamed I was embarrassed. You know what I’m saying I ha-- I felt like I always had so much going on for myself and I think my family had a lot of faith in me like I was gonna make a change in this family, because the things I used to do you know. And uh, and I uh wound up going down the same path of so many of my other family members who have made that same mistake.

I never thought it would be me, I never thought it would be me. Because I’d seen it and thats just something I was always so against, you know. And um, anyway, so my cousin pulled up, I didn't see her coming up but she pulled up in front of the store, and I remember her getting out of the car, she was like, “Katura!” and she just started crying, and she just grabbed me and she just started crying. She was like “Look at you why is you doing this to yourself we know better than this!” Cause she’s my big cousin. Her mom was murdered back in ‘85 um and they found her moms body in Bugula Park, My aunt is Sylvia Parson. Right, so um she just, she’s just way against everything like her mo--I don’t know if her mom was doing drugs because I was little. But I do know she did go to Rutgers I do know that she worked for New Brunswick Police Station, I do know she did some good things, she was young too. You know I think my aunt Sylvia got murdered when she was 23, you know, and um so, its her daughter that had came to me and embraced me like that and she just was like “what are you doin’” you know.

So here we go both ugly crying on the corner (laughs) we got the ugly faces. But um after that, I knew it was out, I knew she was gonna go tell the family, I knew… I was so embarrassed it was just… I don’t know I think I just lost myself, once I picked up I just lost myself. So, here goes Ben trying himself to be the good guy, asshole, he uh (coughs). I told him, “Listen, I don’t wanna do this anymore” I don’t even recognize myself in the mirror, and not being conceited, but I was fly. I’m very creative so I do my own hair, I do my own makeup I do my own eyebrows, you catchin’ me in a pair of sneakers I always had on some type of heels, my purses, my accessories, everything was just nice, you know, thats just what I did I liked to look pretty. Uhm, that-- I didn’t even know who the hell I was, what passed me in the street, hm, that ain’t Katura. You know everybody knew I was fly I come outsi-- I come outside and everybody was waitin’ to see what I got on next, you know it was like that. And um.. So he says, well, okay well “You don’t have to do anything you don’t have to do that no more you dont have to do that but you’re gonna have to do something until you can get-- until I can get out of-- till I get past that part of. He was an asshole, and I was naive, I didn’t know the game like that. He goes, “Instead of you doing the dope, what you can do is you do the coke, and, and it wont affect your body like that”. This was my man, supposed to be, right this guy, that loves me, this guy that loves me this is what he was doing. So, I wind up doing coke, and I actually liked the coke, I actually liked the speed of it. Like, and I didnt have to do a lot of it, it was just like, you know. And so, I ran across a family member of mine, another one, Ima say an aunt, she’s an aunt of mine, we were sitting in the car going somewhere, and I pulled out a bottle of coke, cause she asked me if I did dope no more and I said no I don’t mess with dope no more, I did coke. So she says, “You ever tried cooking it up? You ever try cooking it up?”, because she was a smoker. So what addicts tend to do, is get others hooked to benefit themselves in that addiction. Because she knew that from me dealing with Ben, I had money, I always--If I had drugs I’d have the drugs, I would have it. I didn’t need to go out to do anything for it, because I was his own personal whore you might as well say. You see what I’m saying, I mean it's still paying out but that’s the truth you know.

Um, so. She asked me If I had tried cooking it and I told her no. So she was like, “Well, let me cook a little bit of it up and you can try it with me”. Shit I don’t fucking try other shit okay whatever. So my aunt cooked up some of the coke, and she let me smoke with her. She pulled out the stem, at the time I didn’t know it was-- I didn’t know, about that. You know, and uh, she smoked, and she passed it to me and goes “here, try it out”, and I smoked but I didn’t know what I was supposed to feel. So I didn’t--I didn’t, to me I didn’t feel anything I was probably high as shit but to me I didnt feel anything because I didn't know. So she’s lookin at me she tweakin she tweakin (laughs). She like, “you don't feel that, you don't feel that?”. I remember, I’m like [hums “I don’t know”] I don’t know what I’m supposed to feel I don't know what I’m looking for, so I kept snortin my--um, I kept snortin coke and uh after a while, being around her, a couple of my aunts and a couple other family members-- they were always smoking so I just kinda started smoking with them. And uh, one day I just, I don’t know I just… never stopped. I just never stopped. I just never stopped. Um. So I got really bad, at this time, I had already left Ben, and um I had got with this young guy named Eddie. Eddie was a sweetheart and.. Wait hold on, before I start doing all of that kinda hard hard stuff I had got with Eddie but I was going back and forth between Eddie and Ben, I was messing with the both of them. But Ben was getting fucked up, Eddie wasn’t Eddie was just taking really good care of me and loved me--He really loved me, really really loved me he was a sweetheart, really sweet. Always respected me, my grandmother loved him. Now my family loved this one (laughs) now he’s still in my family now today we haven’t been together in years. I just seen Eddie yesterday. Um so, um. Eddie used to sell drugs though. So when I did start getting high, and I got to that point, I always had it then too. Because Eddie had it, and he wasn’t gonna give me nothing if he found out I was getting high because he didn’t know because I was sneaking, going back and forth doing different things. And um, so he didn’t want to give me any drugs, he was like “why would I give you drugs, you're my girl” whatever whatever I’m like “well, you need to start doing something”, start putting the pressure on him, “because if not, I’m gonna be out here like these girls and” you know so--make him feel bad, he did it worked and I don’t know why (laughs) that was horrible Katura. You know, but um, there was times that he’d give me stuff and he would be like “just go chill go somewhere dont be out here acting crazy” you know, whatever. And then I started stealing from him. Um, I would-- at that time I was already going back and forth with jail. I didn’t see any jail I don't know how many times. Those were the only breaks I got from getting high, was when I was sitting in jail. So, Ima move forward now.

Alright, now after all of this with me and Eddie me and Eddie wind up separating because of drugs. He couldn’t take it no more he like. Eddie wind up going to jail, um behind the drugs and drug dealing and stuff like that. But Eddie wound up turning his life around, now he works in like a facility for people who’s addicted. Now he helps them, instead of killing them, you see, it flipped for him. Which is a blessing, it's amazing I'm so proud of him. You know, um so, I had.. Wind up um reaching out, I got into contact-- I started looking for my dad. Now at this time, i'm in my twenties like… I need to do something with my life, I need to figure out what's going on with me, as a person because I felt like I was losing my mind. I was very isolated, I didn’t want to be around nobody, I felt weird around people. I always felt weird around people. Just something didn’t feel right to me it was always like I was picking up on other people’s energy and I just couldn't-- I didn’t know how to handle that. Um so I spoke to my dad. My biological--my birth father, the one who had been in prison for murder, right? So now he says you know, I wanna meet you I want us to meet, you know try to grow a relationship, and Im like yeah I’m happy my real dad (inaudible). So I was 27 years old when I first met my dad face to face. Um and the first thing he said to me, he looked at me and said “hm you better be glad youre my daughter”. That right there, was fucked up. But, I just wanted my dad so bad I just acted like I didn't hear what he said, right, I just wanted my dad. So, well you know we uh went in uh him and my mom did a little talk and then they sat there and played some cards and stuff so when they were on their way out I told him I said “well I wanna come back to Florida with you, I think I need to get outta here because I’m not doing good, and I need to get my life together”. My son, all that time he has been with my Grandmother. My Grandmother now, was taking care of him. She actually was raising the both of us basically like I did the schooling thing you know. I was back and forth between her and my mom. So now my son is with my Grandmother, and then I was kinda repeating my mom's footsteps like, left him with her and now I’m running, like how my mom used to do to me. And I remember that feeling that wasn't a good feeling, I used to hate that, you know.

Um, so my dad told me that...he didn't have nowhere for me to stay. That he didn't think his wife would allow me um there so he left, but I wound up following behind him anyway. I had hitchhiked some tractor trailers, didn’t know these men didn’t know nothing, this is how crazy I was. I just picked up and left. I didn’t get no clothes, I just jumped in the truck with the clothes I had on my back and a dry ass wig on my head looking crazy. I jumped in the truck, said “Florida”, and in my mind, that's all where I needed to be. So he drove me to Jacksonville Florida but my family lived in Gainesville but I had some in Jacksonville too. I didn’t know them though. So once I hit Jacksonville I call my father, “Here I am!”, He had no choice but to come pick me up-- he had a choice but he was like “Okay well how did you get out here?”. I said I hitchhiked down here and he was like “Girl you crazy”. Right, so, uh he came and got me, we left. I remember I called my son and I told my son “Nijer momma’s gonna get herself together” I said “now do you wanna stay there with Nana or do you wanna come down here with me” I said “because if you come down here with me we’re gonna be struggling it out”. And he said “I’ll come struggle it out with you”. That's what my oldest son said, so I said “Okay give me a little time, I’m gonna send for you”. WIthin the next two months, I was standing infront of a judge, looking at 15 years with an attempted murder charge.

Okay, so it was this guy that I had met when I was out there that I was dealing with. Um and I actually was living with the guy in Florida. Uhm and uh I was high off some shit and um he--he was like every other guy to me, and I kinda just snapped. We had got into an argument, and the argument led to me going into the kitchen grabbing a knife, and I stabbed him. I stabbed him in his neck. And it was just like so much blood and stuff. And he wound up getting--I think he ended up getting lifelighted though, because that's how much damage I did to him. Um, so I didn’t go to jail right away for that because he couldn’t really prove who did anything because he was in a coma or whatever, he was gone, he was like--I thought the man was dead. You know, and to be honest with you, at that moment, that's where my mindset was like I was supposed to kill him, kill him like I’m about to kill this [explicit]. Straight up, he’s going down, I just felt like don't out your hands on me whatsoever. So, I met another guy, right after I did this to this one, moved in with him, got a job and worked like everything was normal. This guy never knew what I did to the other one, never knew anything, didn't have no clue who he was laying next to. You understand what I’m saying. And Its not like I’m a bad person, it's just that I was so damaged inside and the older that I got and then dealing with drugs and stuff, the chemical imbalances on top of the trauma and everything it just was not a good combination. My mind was just going in so many different type of speeds, its like losin-- I lost myself, I couldn't figure-- I couldn’t get a grasp on it I used to like hear voices and like I used to go through that.

[Annotation 6]

Thank god I hadn’t in years. But, I used to experience stuff like that. And um, so one day im sitting there in my room watching TV and they have this one channel, like a local channel in Florida, and like wanted, and my picture popped up. I was like “What the” and I was in the news. They had me as one of the people--like the different lines out of the show, one of the people that they wanted and there was a $500 rewar--and they had a $500 reward for me, for what I did to that guy. Cause now I guess he was able to tell them exactly what happened and my name and everything. Now mind you when I got down there I ended up in jail immediately because I bust somebody in the head. So now they had got me in the system there, thats the picture that they put up. I wound up getting caught, and I was sentence-- she tried to give me an attempted murder charge um but I guess the prosecutor worked with my attorney and they dropped it. They said, if you take this plea, you’ll get only five but if you don’t take this plea you’re automatically getting 15 years. What do you wanna do? I said I’ll take the five. So they gave me five years with an aggravated assault charge with a deadly weapon. Um, I spent the five years in pris--needless to say I never went and got Nijer, poor baby. I stayed in prison, five years, I started kinda like, within my third year I was able to kinda like change my life around, and you know I became an aerobics instructor, I started to jog a lot I became really healthy, I became a vegetarian, I stopped eating all kind of meat I used to write a lot. Then I started taking classes for culinary art um. I actually felt like I did more in there then I did when I was on the street, for myself more positive things. Uh so 2013, I came home and I met this guy name Darryl, Darryl called himself Aminhotep but I met Darryl and I met Darryl at the job that I had. I start workin-- as soon as I got out of prison I immediately went out and got me a job. Even though it was a agency, that's why I don't understand when he was like “Oh aint nobody gon”-- maybe you can't just go to--inside of the place and get a regular job like how you probably want to but agencies are always open. Like so, I went and straight got me a job with like 2 weeks out of me coming out of prison I went to work. 

[Annotation 7] [Annotation 8]

So I met Darryl there, and me and Darryl used to talk a lot and you know he was different, but he was on the type of page that I was on at that moment because he was into yoga, he was into health. Like keeping your body good and at that time this was the state of mind that I was in, so we kinda worked out together we worked pretty good together. Um I was celebate so and he respected that you know, because I wasn’t trying to give nothing up. Um and we talked for about a good two years or whatever. So Darryl wound up getting locked up and I didn’t see him for a while but I knew where he was at so I would write him, You know kept contact. So he finally came home, he came home to me, me and Darryl wind up  getting together, I found out I was pregnant. 21 years later after my son, right. I didn’t even know if I could have more kids, yup. Find out I was pregnant, pregnant with twins, a boy and a girl. Mhm, needless to say. So Nazori and Darryl, call them (inaudible) and papa, who are in PA, right now as I speak with my aunt, um. I winded up, uh going to a program. I went into this program because after Darryl had got locked up, I kinda resorted back to the street, I relapsed. So uh I knew I had these kids to take care of, And I’m like Oh my God I can’t do this, I winded up going to the program, which leaves me here now, I go into the program, got um help with housing and stuff.

Once I completed the program, I got a job at the McDonald’s while I was there, moved my way up from a crew member to management, went and got me a three bedroom house that actually I still have. Uh and me and the twins were just doing the damn thing, I got my lisence in October of last year October first I got my driver’s license, I got me a 2007 Chevy Trailblazer Burgundy, thats in the shop now out here. Um, and then I just um, their father had came home, he got locked up again, came home and then I brought him out to pottsville with me to live with me he uh wounded up trying to kill me, tried to burn my house, uh because we got into it about the way he was talking to our daughter and I didn’t like I cause I’ll tell you my daughter is very sensitive, and she’ll tell you “You hurt my feelings!” you know, shes very outspoken, something that I wasn’t, so I allowed them to express themselves. I don't hold them back, you feel some sort of way, somebody is um affecting you a type, well you express yourself. So after that, he got locked up, and I did good for a while, and um.. But I just didnt wanna be there in that house no more. So here I am, and since I’ve been out here for the past two weeks, Ive just been out here… drinking, uhm acting retarded I’m not gonna lie. This is just not for me so, thats it, Basically leads me up to today. It was too much. 

What Brought you back to New Brunswick? 

I actually was giving somebody a ride to Staten Island from Pennsylvania, um it was me me aunt and the twins, and we wound up getting lost. But we wounded up over here by this way, so I said, We might as well stop to go see Nana, cause-- Oh did I tell you I’m a grandmom? Oh he calls me super grandmom, my older son has a son now, who is the same age as my twins. Um so I told my aunt I said we might as well go out to see my grandson and my son and my nana, make a stop out here. Stopped out here, that night I let my son use my truck, he brought my truck back my truck was smoking. I don’t know what the hell that boy did with my car but, and I’ve been stuck since. I don’t know, I just wanna go, I just want my truck. So I’m trying to wait until-- I’m about to do my income tax, and I got a nice chunk coming back to me. So I’m trying to work that out, so I can just pay for everything in one shot when I get the truck out. I don’t wanna leave it because its-- its mine its bought for I paid it off, its mine. I don’t I don’t--Its my first car I ever had, I had never had a car. You know I worked hard for this shit. And thats why I was so angry at him I was like what happened? You know. Um cause the truck was fine. Anyway, so this is where, I kinda just got stuck out here and stayed out here. My aunt went back somebody came and picked my aunt up and she took the twins back with her. So thats it. And I haven’t been here in years, Elijah’s promise. I haven’t been back in New Brunswick in four years. I haven’t been back here for four years, and this morning when I had got up, I was at this guy that I know. He’ll let people come stay late sometimes. He’s that type of person, because I’ve known him for so many years, he’ll be like “Okay come crash”, and he’d go in there with his mom, but his mom is older so he’ll sleep in the chair while his mom lays down and you know.

So I just like, you know I don’t eat their food or anything I kinda just, I'll go out and get my own so l just-- like you know I’m gonna go to the soup kitchen today. And go eat something and. Because sometimes I cant even eat. I really, I pretty much just feel like after what happened between me and the twins father, I worked so hard to get my family together and to turn my life around and for us to be like a whole, I didn’t want to be a single parent, I was in the clear! My son was 21 years old. I ain’t have nobody else to worry about. And here you are coming along and giving me twins right, and supposed to be this great man, and you dont even pair enough to be who you presented yourself to be. I told him I said listen, I don’t wanna be no single parent I dont wanna be another statistic when it comes to this shit I dont wanna have to go through. But no were gonna do this, because the twins were actually planned. I didn’t know we were gonna have twins, but the baby was planned, you know I never-- I never had met nobody after Eddie really, now Eddie, I don’t have no children with Eddie, you gotta remember I had a son before Eddie, but me and Eddie our baby passed away. Um but so after that it was you know so I was in love with Darryl, actually I still am, and it hurts, it hurts because now he’s in prison, again, for what he did to me now, and the twins are about to be four and he’s not gonna be coming home until they’re around seven. So, I just didn’t wanna be there no more, in the house, with everything going on with mom and family, I just kinda got really really depressed, I’ve been under depression for the last couple of months though, so Im trying to-- I don’t know I’m trying to just work through it. You know, thats pretty much it. 

Um, why did Darryl get arrested those first couple of times? 

Um, Darryl be lying so damn much. I don’t to be hon-- okay, I think Darryl, the one that I know about was that his brothers’ baby mom house got raided because him and his brother was pretty close. Um and kids were in there, drugs were in there, so he had a dangering the welfare of a child because it was their drugs, and a drug charge, so he got locked up. And this is when we first met, I didn’t even know he was selling drugs, He was working though, but I didn’t know this man was selling drugs too, he could’ve fooled the hell out of me. So he got locked up, and then he came home, and I think--cause he--I don’t know something he did where he violated, he was on paper. Then he went back, and then he came home, and he stayed home, until he did what he did to me. 

And I didnt wanna call the cops on him, I did not want to but he scared me--he choked me out so bad he put me like--he put me on a whol--he kept repeating to me that he was gonna kill me. And I thought he was really gonna kill me, I believed Darryl probably would’ve. But I had to like, kinda like soothe him like, I was soothing him I talked to him kinda like I was trying to talk him through--like begging him basically like please just, I love you, just tryna, you know. And just, and just everything got fucked up. He wasn’t even at the house for two weeks, I had just got him back home, just got our family back together, me him and the twins, you know. I’m working hard, I like coming home and cooking for my family every day. I like giving them baths and running his bath water and doing his little candles and stuff just so he can have his little self time for himself and like we go out places and take the kids and go have fun or we all just go out to eat maybe if I don’t feel like cooking. Sometimes we had like picnics in the middle of the living room ‘cause you know we didn’t always have money but we always was doing something, and I used to have fun with him. It was like, I could play with him, we could kinda be like kids at times. I--it was just like, I don’t know. But he just- its the certain part of him that just takes over him, he gets angry, and he’s a whole other person. And I know my temperament, but when I see his, it makes me calm down, because I’m like damn is that how I am? You know? And I try to calm him down so instead of me adding fuel to the fire by me allowing myself to flare up too, I try to calm him down. Uh, but for him to tell me that he’s trying to kill me, Darryl and I, I don’t care how much I love him we would never be able to be anymore now. And then, you did that infront of my fucking kids, our kids, why the fuck would you do that? He had been abused all his fucking live, I’ve been fucked up, we spoke about these things, we had intimate conversations about these things so he knows, theres just things you dont do. Just because this person did that to you, why am I gonna turn around and do that to you?

I feel like now this is how I think, like, I feel like because I was hurt so much that's the more love I try to give my kids. I try to do the total opposite with my children. And he did that in front of them and the way I remember my kids was crying, that was fucked up, he was fucked up for doing that shit. And now you’re going and you don’t care that I’m out here struggling to raise these kids by my fucking self. Fucking selfish ass [Explicit], sitting here, you getting fed three times a day, you don’t pay no fucking rent, you understand, you got a roof over your head, you clothe, and then when he went at me and my dumb ass had the nerve I was sending him money, he just tried to kill me. I’m running up every Saturday, trying to see him me and the kids and. This was before I had the truck I was walking. Pushing these heavy babies up a fucking hill to go to see someone who tried to fucking kill me. Whats wrong with me then, right? Oh I’m sorry, you know I just--but it just don’t sit. So I kinda just, when I left this time, I cut him off, because I don’t think he would ever stop hurting me. I think as long as he knows that he could continue to come back, the situation would be worse, I don’t think that I would make it out alive next time, because he’s gonna think like, he’s the type of person, “Well if I’m goin the fuck to jail, I’ma take her out”, you know, he’s that type of person. So I know, because you know I called the cops on him the first time. So, he--if he knows that, he aint--he gonna kill me. That man will kill me. He was a-- He had his times where he was a--I felt like he was a great father, he was very active with the kids, in the kids lives, when he was around. When I was in the program he used to send all of my stuff, send the kids over seven hundred dollars worth of clothes or something I had boxes and boxes coming in to the point where the ladies at the program said he’s gotta stop sending stuff (laughs). But I think what it was is that he tries to make up for the times that he’s always out, in and out there alot so he tries to make it up so that he feels better about himself being a father, so that he doesn’t feel like a deadbeat. Um thats it. 

When was the last time you used drugs? 

The last time I used drugs? Um, probably like a week ago. Yeah… I was chilling. But they don’t depend on me no more you know. I thought it was something I wanted but it wasn't what I wanted. So what I do like to drink, I do enjoy drinking that’s just my shit. Um, and I love men, that’s just my shit. Um, pretty much it. 

How’s Nijer Doing? 

Nijer’s doing good, he’s doing good. He’s at work now. He’s at work. My grandson is probably with Nana or somebody. Um yeah.

Katura you said you had skipped earlier a lot I’m not sure if you knew what that was if you wanna go back to that. 

Oh um, okay so what I was thinking about was, after the situation happened with me going from um… Once my stepfather got locked up, right, and he was going back and forth to court, um, the whole time my mother would not speak to me, my mother would not acknowledge me, she would sit uh, oh my little snack (laughs). She would literally sit on his side of the courtroom and freaking ignore me, it just was a lot. I don’t know. Because I didn’t go into like details at the fullest, of what I’ve really experienced um. But I can handle it okay, so when I was with them, my mom kinda like would like be there while he would like do certain things and stuff. So if I would’ve told on her, she would’ve been In jail too, she would’ve been right in prison with him. But I never told on my mom, and that wasn’t good enough for her. She still betrayed me. But um.. I don’t know, it was just a lot. It was just a whole fucking lot to do to me. I don’t know thats pretty much it, that's it in a nutshell. I’m sure there's a lot of other shit, I’m just trying not to be too long I’m not sure how long this recording shit.. Its okay?

Yeah, you can have another 30 minutes if you want 

Uh, um my stepdad...he used to just like--used to do shit just to torture me like, put my hands on the stove, burn me, I’ve been burnt twice by him. He burnt me with an electric stove I mean literally he’d just place my hands on it, burn me. He would wick it like that, he did it with electric, and gas. It was to the point where I had blisters coming out of my hands, I was little I was like nine? Nine ten years old when I used to get that shit done? He kinda like tied me up and shit like that. So, I think the tying up shit stuck with me because as I got older and started using drugs and doing shit, I used to tie people up, I started doing shit like that. Like I would tie them up like, and um like rob them. Like (coughs) I was I kinda got crazy I kinda started feeling um...like I didn’t like coming across somebody, like if it was a guy I like-- he was trying to play me, he was trying to take advantage, you know I used to trick, you know. But I had like--I had clients and um so uhm but I felt like if I randomly dealt with someone like say if I didn’t have no appointments or nothing for that day, and I just took something off the street, which is never cool. Um, then anything was liable to happen. And if I came across anyone who was like trying to cheat me out of my money saying he wanting to do something or whatever, I would literally tie the asses up and whoop them (laughs). That was crazy, um… I’d rob them um but my stepfather left a lot of shit in me I had to go through the process of learning how to love again, learning that all men aren’t the same, you know, but for a while I used to have a whole lot of animosity towards men I think that's why I used to behave the way I did. 

[Annotation 9]

And nobody wasn’t tying me down, I’d have good guys come along and be like well I want you to be my woman and we can do this and I was like, I can't I can’t I just can’t and like now… I’m kinda like, almost to that point again now. Im just-- I love men, to deal with them, to have sex with them, if I feel like were compatible or whatever. But just to stay with them to be their girl, I feel like I don’t want that anymore yeah I think the pain of knowing how vulnerable I am, because I would completely give you my all you know. And I don’t think I’m in for another heartbreak so I just keep it simple, get what I think I need at that moment and what I want and at the same time I please them too, because I’m still conscious of how a man likes to feel you know what I’m saying so, I don’t know. I kinda go like hunting I think, I don’t know if its because I’m getting older now, and I’ve changed so much, but I have good company sometimes though. And it don’t matter your race, I don’t care white, black, spanish, as long as we can get along and are compatible, you’re all right with me. I don’t care about stuff like that. Some people do. Well actually, I don’t really like to deal with black men like that because um they’re always trying to like, I don’t know.